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Dear Mr McNabb, "Son of the Abbot" I think you've said too much in your post above! EC's do NOT think the later Roman Councils are invalid at all! Which EC has ever said that? ANATHEMA!  It is ONLY a question of whether they are Local Councils or Universal Councils - that's all. They truly do appear to be Local Councils as they address internal Roman Church issues that have NEVER cropped up in the Eastern Churches. The Orthodox also have their Local Councils, some of whose canons have been made Universal and binding on world Orthodoxy. That is the gist of the matter. So if we were neighbours and lived side by side in separate houses and your basement flooded, but mine didn't, I don't see why I should have to be involved with your discussions with the City authorities to settle the financial aspects of the repairs! It was your basement that was flooded and not mine. I love my dry basement and am writing to you from it right now! Alex
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic: Dear Mr McNabb, "Son of the Abbot"
I think you've said too much in your post above!
EC's do NOT think the later Roman Councils are invalid at all!
Which EC has ever said that? ANATHEMA!
It is ONLY a question of whether they are Local Councils or Universal Councils - that's all.
They truly do appear to be Local Councils as they address internal Roman Church issues that have NEVER cropped up in the Eastern Churches.
The Orthodox also have their Local Councils, some of whose canons have been made Universal and binding on world Orthodoxy.
That is the gist of the matter.
So if we were neighbours and lived side by side in separate houses and your basement flooded, but mine didn't, I don't see why I should have to be involved with your discussions with the City authorities to settle the financial aspects of the repairs!
It was your basement that was flooded and not mine.
I love my dry basement and am writing to you from it right now!
Alex I can see how this arguement might fit for some of the councils, but many of the Dogmatic declarations of the "western" Councils seem, IMO, to have a great deal of effect on Eastern Catholics. Such as Papal Infalibility and Purgatory. I do not understand how one could deny those two essential Dogmas (though I can see how one might use Eastern Theological terms to define the exact same Dogma, such as Toll houses for Purgatory)
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Dear "Son of the Abbot,"
The East has always prayed for the dead and even more than the West ever has. The East accepts that the dead are in Hades awaiting final release - "Hades" is, in part, what the West refers to as "Purgatory" - the latter term was concocted by Western theologians for want of a better word.
As for the Papal doctrines - the East has ALWAYS accepted the Primacy of Rome.
And the East, in the first millennium, always saw Rome as the ultimate arbiter and referee in disputes between, say, Patriarch and Emperor (a much needed referee!).
And the teaching authority of Rome - dating from Pope Clement I - was likewise always recognized by the Orthodox Catholic Church of the East.
So even the papal doctrines didn't tell Eastern Catholics anything they didn't know or believe already from when they were (and believe they still are) Orthodox.
However, we EC's believe that the teachings on papal infallibility are incomplete, rather.
They require further elucidation and explanation.
So we await further papal pronouncements on primacy of jurisdiction and infallibility to COMPLETELY reflect the way these two issues were understood and practiced by the once United Church of Christ of the first millennium.
Alex
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
Dear "Son of the Abbot,"
The East has always prayed for the dead and even more than the West ever has. The East accepts that the dead are in Hades awaiting final release - "Hades" is, in part, what the West refers to as "Purgatory" - the latter term was concocted by Western theologians for want of a better word.
As for the Papal doctrines - the East has ALWAYS accepted the Primacy of Rome.
And the East, in the first millennium, always saw Rome as the ultimate arbiter and referee in disputes between, say, Patriarch and Emperor (a much needed referee!).
And the teaching authority of Rome - dating from Pope Clement I - was likewise always recognized by the Orthodox Catholic Church of the East.
So even the papal doctrines didn't tell Eastern Catholics anything they didn't know or believe already from when they were (and believe they still are) Orthodox.
However, we EC's believe that the teachings on papal infallibility are incomplete, rather.
They require further elucidation and explanation.
So we await further papal pronouncements on primacy of jurisdiction and infallibility to COMPLETELY reflect the way these two issues were understood and practiced by the once United Church of Christ of the first millennium.
Alex Lol "Son of the abbot" I assume that is ment to be a compliment.
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Yes I'm sure it is; I believe that is the meaning of your name "McNabb", and I'm sure that Alex knows that the early Celtic monks were not always celibate, and that abbots were frequently the local patriarch.
-Daniel
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Daniel, I think then not much has changed in that area  . ICXC NIKA
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Originally posted by iconophile:
Yes I'm sure it is; I believe that is the meaning of your name "McNabb", and I'm sure that Alex knows that the early Celtic monks were not always celibate, and that abbots were frequently the local patriarch.
-Daniel Lol no he is comparing me to Father Michael Mary C.SS.R. the Abbot of the SSPX affiliated redemptorists.
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
[. . .]
It is ONLY a question of whether they are Local Councils or Universal Councils - that's all.
They truly do appear to be Local Councils as they address internal Roman Church issues that have NEVER cropped up in the Eastern Churches.
The Orthodox also have their Local Councils, some of whose canons have been made Universal and binding on world Orthodoxy.
That is the gist of the matter.
[. . .]
Alex Alex, I agree. Thus, the fourteen "general" councils of the West are merely local synods, which are not binding upon Eastern Christians. Similarly, the Blachernae Council of A.D. 1285, and the Palamite Councils of the fourteenth century -- which are clearly local synods of the East -- are not binding upon Western Christians. As far as the question of the primacy is concerned, Easterners should only be required to accept that doctrine as it was formulated and lived during the first millennium (See Joseph Cardinal Ratzinger, "Principles of Catholic Theology," page 199).
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Dear "Son of the Abbot"
No, Sir, I would NEVER do that and my reference to you above is NOT intended to compare you to anyone other than the meaning of the name "McNabb" that Daniel has quite correctly identified as signifying "son of the abbot" and referring to the early Celtic tradition of allowing abbots and monastics to have wives.
This was abolished at the Synod of Whitby along with other Celtic practices such as the Celtic Easter calculation, the "tonsure of Simon Magus" - from side to side, the Celtic practice of refraining from Holy Communion on Easter Sunday until "Little Easter" or St Thomas Sunday and others.
If it offends you, as it appears that it does, this will be the last time I use this play on "MacNabb."
I apologise for having caused you discomfort or the semblance of offense in this - please forgive me, but it is my style in dealing with people I am fond of. And I am fond of everyone on this forum - some more than others . . .
Alex
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
Dear "Son of the Abbot"
No, Sir, I would NEVER do that and my reference to you above is NOT intended to compare you to anyone other than the meaning of the name "McNabb" that Daniel has quite correctly identified as signifying "son of the abbot" and referring to the early Celtic tradition of allowing abbots and monastics to have wives.
This was abolished at the Synod of Whitby along with other Celtic practices such as the Celtic Easter calculation, the "tonsure of Simon Magus" - from side to side, the Celtic practice of refraining from Holy Communion on Easter Sunday until "Little Easter" or St Thomas Sunday and others.
If it offends you, as it appears that it does, this will be the last time I use this play on "MacNabb."
I apologise for having caused you discomfort or the semblance of offense in this - please forgive me, but it is my style in dealing with people I am fond of. And I am fond of everyone on this forum - some more than others . . .
Alex Lol no you did not offend me at all haha. Sorry I am not particulary knowledgable about my own last name, its a borrowed last name because my familiy isn't Scottish on any side of it haha. My native american ancestors took it as a last name (Since native americans lack last names) to honor a scottish friend or something like that. Anyways my interpurtation of it didn't offend me anyways, I am quite suprised I haven't been called a "lefebvrist" yet lol...
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Dear McNabb, I can oblige you, if you like! Alex
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