www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Mary as Mediatrix from an Eastern Perspective

Dear Brothers in the Most Holy Faith.
I know that this topic was brought up before but this time I would like to give it new insight.
And that is Mary as Mediatrix from and Eastern perspective.
For truly this is where the theology of Mary as Mediatrix has its orgin and not in the Western Church as many presume.
It orginated in the East after the Oecumenical Council of Ephesus 431 AD. and was not received into the West until the eigth or ninth century.

It is not clear as to who actually used the title of Mediatrix for Mary but however it is clear that it originated in the East as an offshoot of the Churches' reflection on the mystery of the Incarnation, that is. "the Word became flesh and dwelt among us." Mary's present intercession in heaven was envisioned as a continuation of her gracious maternal role on earth. In a special way among the Apostles and other saints she joined in the prayer of Christ for those still struggling, thus co operatig with the salvific pland of God by means of which saving grace was poured out on sinners.
Now lets take a look at some liturgical texts and patristic quotes which back up this theory.

1 The Akathistos Hymn to the Blessed Virgin Mary
"Hail, thou "through whom" the Creator became a babe... Hail heavenly ladder "by which" God came down.... Hail "bridge that carries" the earth-born to heaven.

2. "You also by fulfilling the office of Mediatrix, and being made the ladder of God descending to us, that he should assume our weak nature and join and unite it to himself... you brought together what had been seperated.
(John Damascene PG96:713)

3. "When you, God bearer, were made the dwelling of the Holy Spirit, then did human beings become spiritual. No one is filled with the knowledge of God "except through you", O Mother of God.. no one secures a gift of mercy except through you, O worthy one who holds God.
(Germanus of Constantinople - PG98:349

Germanus also stated that Mary's intercession is all powerful, for God obeys her as a good don his mother; and that her intercession turns away the sentence of damnation justly passed on sinners, for as a mother her heart is inclinded to be merciful.

Bretheren any comments or thoughts?
Stephanos I

Through the prayers of the Mother of God, O Savior save our souls.

Dear Father,

Bless!

Thankyou so much for these quotes about the intercessory nature of our most blessed Lady Theotokos, and I am in total agreement with them, and especally with the following:

Germanus also stated that Mary's intercession is all powerful, for God obeys her as a good don his mother; and that her intercession turns away the sentence of damnation justly passed on sinners, for as a mother her heart is inclinded to be merciful.

In Christ,
Alice

At the same time it's good to remember that the author and creator of mercy is God. The Theotokos wouldn't be merciful if it wasn't for God. God is what makes her so holy, because she is filled with Him. (I'm not trying to correct anyone or say that they don't already know this. It's just good to remember this at the same time as all the above mentioned quotes.)

Dunstan,
Originally I was going to end my reflection with the phrase that we always have to keep in mind that Mary was a human creature like us and there is an immense gulf between her the creature and the Creator. Of course "everything" that the Blessed Virgin Mary had was a gift from God.
Needless to say for any "orthodox" christian.
Stephanos I

Dear Stephanos I:

Thank you for saying this. You're good at expressing things theologically.

I'm actually reading Mary Through the Centuries by Jaroslav Pelikan right now. Pelikan takes an unbiased and scholarly approach to the role of Mariam of Nazareth in popular culture, both secular and religious. He devotes a chapter to Mary as the Mediatrix, and clearly documents that this nomenclature for the Theotokos first arose in the East. Maybe if this discussion heats up I'll look up a few of his quotes.

Logos Teen

It may have been St Ephrem the Syrian who first used the term mediatrix. A 4th century prayer attributed to him says of her "After the Mediator thou art the mediatrix of the whole world".

As for the theology of Mary as Mediatrix not being received in the West until the 8th or 9th century, this is not true. St Ambrose of Milan had already written extensively on the subject in the 4th century.

Lawrence
This may be true> I cannot verify it as I gave away my collection of Patristic books to a theology student some time back and now I cant retrieve them on the computer.

I was refering I think generally in the West it was not advanced until the 8th or 9th century.
While I have no doubt that individuals wrote about Mary as Mediatrix before then.

And now to heat things up a notch and in the words of Emril "Bam".

How does this relate to Mary as Mediatrix of all graces.
Can it not be said that since she is the Mother of God, the mother of the savior that her obedience brought about a new relationship for humanity?
Is not the earliest image that we have of Mary in the New Testament a revelation of the New Eve or Scond Eve?
This antithetical parallelism between Eve and Mary, particularly as developed by St Irenaeus (2nd Cent.), portrays the mother as receiving an intimate share in the total victory of the Son over sin and death, over satan the ancient serpent in Genesis. Cf Gen 3 and Revelation 12

Justin Martyr says the following "For Eve who was a virgin undefiled, having conceived the word of the serpent, brought forth disobedience and death. But the Virgin Mary ..received faith and joy.
Irenaeus carries this further "In accordance with this design, Mary the Virgin is found obedient .. but Eve was disobedient, for she did not obey when as yet she was a virgin. Eve having become disobedient was made the cause of death, both for herself and the entire human race: so also did Mary by yielding obedience become the cause of salvation both for herself and the whole human race. The knot of Eve's disobedience was loosed by the obedience of Mary. For what the virgin Eve had bound fast through unbelief, this did the Virgin Mary set free through faith. And if the former did disobey God, yet the latter was pursuaded to be obedient to God, in order that the Virgin Mary might become the advocate of the virgin Eve.
And thus the human race gell into bondage to death by means of a virgin, so it is rescued by a virgin.

Did not eve become the mother of all the living in the Old Testament and Mary the mother of all the spiritually alive became their mother at the foot of the Cross.

Is not Mary the the Mediatrix of all grace, not in the sense of its source or origin for this would be clearly heretical, but in its mediation in her giving birth to the worlds savior?

Brethren your comments.
Stephanos I

Hey, don't forget us sisteren!

Father bless!


I have no real grasp of what "Mary as the mediatrix of all graces" means. Mary as the mother of God - sure - as much as any human can understand it. Mother of Christians, Mother of Martyrs. Stole for those who lack freedom to speak.

What does it mean? Well, she's the mother of Jesus, and He pays attention to her. He acts on his own too, but when she takes him aside and says "they have no wine," he responds - with overwhelming generosity. The relationship endures...

Of course, she ALWAYS says, "do whatever He tells you."

Just a few possibly random thoughts.

Oh and HAPPY BIRTHDAY O All-PURE ONE!!!!!!!


Sharon

God's blessing Sharon.
Of course the "sistern" (lol) are included, I was using brethren in the generic sense as in European language usage.

This thought of Mary as the mediatrix of all graces is simply that she by her consent to God's will has gained all grace for the human race.
She is not the source of grace that comes from God alone but she has merited it by her fiat.

Peace
Stephanos I

Possibly the greatest words ever known to have been spoken by our Blessed Mother are from the Gospel of St John 2:5. To this day the Mother of our Lord still says "Do whatever he tells you". As Mediatrix our Blessed Mother only acts in accordance with the will of her Divine Son.

Lawrence,
Glory to Jesus Christ!

As I recall, these were also the last words spoken by the Mother of God in Scripture.

Once these words were spoken, there was no need to speak further. The significance is astounding.

Deacon El

Perhaps the theologically gifted can help me here, (I'm not), but I was reading one time on the internet what some proponents of the doctrine of Mediatrix of All Graces were saying, and quite frankly I had a real problem with it. It seemed to me what they were saying is that whenever you pray to Jesus, that when He responds to your prayers it always goes through Mary to you. It seemed what they were saying is that each and everytime God gives you any grace or anything, that this grace or help or love or anything from God always passes through Mary first, and then is mediated to you. I have a real problem with this line of thinking. I don't have a problem with Mary as Mediatrix, or even that she CAN be a Mediatrix of all graces, but to say that she HAS to be the Mediatrix of all graces, that no grace can come to you unless it passes through her first is really going out on a limb. Ofcourse this website I am referring to is Latin, which thinks in a post first millenium Latin mode. I know in the East one says grace and not graces. But that being aside, I know alot of Latins have a hard time with going out on a limb about this issue as well, and that it's only some Latins who want this doctrine proclaimed.

Can anyone clarify this issue for me? Perhaps I'm not understanding what those particular Latins are saying. What is the Eastern take on all this?

Please be patient with me as I'm not a theologian, and I'm not good at expressing ideas or questions on the internet.

Pray for me,

Dunstan

One more thing. I may have gotten it reversed. They may have been saying that when you pray to Jesus, each and every time, your prayers MUST go through Mary as Mediatrix of All Graces before He can respond to your prayer. So the prayer doesn't go to Him directly, but must pass through her first, and then goes to Him. I can't remember for sure. At any rate, it would be nice if some people here could clarify what those people were saying, and then explain what the Eastern way of putting it is. Eastern theological modes of thinking have a way of making more sense to me.