www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West latin/eastern parishes, what is proper edicate ?

my question is one i always had ever since i became byzantine..what should i do in a latin rite church? such as genuflect vs. bow, latin crossing or byzantine? i feel as i should stick to my byzantine ways even in latin churches but feel it can be somewhat disrespectful and even confusing for latins to see someone cross(i.e.) different then them. any official canonical law on this? if any? thanks this question also goes for when Latin-riters who attend eastern liturgies

When in Rome - be it old Rome or New Rome - do as the Romans do.

When in a Latin Church I Genuflect. I do as they do. I only bless myself Byzantine where ever I am though.

I dont mind if people visiting me dunk their biscuits in the tea. I just thought I would share that bit. Just in case anyone should find themsleves wondering on the western edge of the Nullarbor Desert (guess where the name came from) and need a cuppa (tea/coffee).

ICXC
NIKA

My personal code is that I cross myself Byzantine (with two fingers in the Old Ritualist way) wherever I am.

Now, the bit about kneeling is a bit more complicated. I rarely find myself at a Novus Ordo Mass - I do, however, find myself quite often at Tridentine Masses. When I'm at a Tridentine Mass, I'm usually part of the chant schola, so I'm rarely in a pew and usually off to one side or at the rear of the church.

If it's Mass on a weekday outside Eastertide (by OUR calculation), I will kneel as the Latins do, with the exception of three prostrations - at the consecrations and the Ecce Agnus Dei. If it's Mass on a Sunday, or a weekday within Eastertide (by OUR calculation), I stand throughout almost. Being part of the schola and usually at the back of the church, I manage to wiggle my way so that I'm behind everyone else - that way I can continue to stand and not scandalise other people. Also, if it's Sunday or within Eastertide, I replace my 3 prostrations with waist bows.

That's just my own personal typicon of bows...

I am a Byzantine, and also organist in a Latin parish. I do what Byzantines do. If they don't like it and can get another organist for what they pay me, let them. :p However, the pastor is very supportive of the local Byzantine mission, so there is no problem. He has been one of our best friends and supporters.

What is it that you do in their Church that the parish priest needs to be supportive? Should we be worried? Are special prayers required? I trust you dont go without putting on mother's best bloomers and the nice socks that glow in the dark, so you can see where your feet are on the peddles .

ICXC
NIKA

When our Byzantine mission started - before it even became an official mission - this Latin Rite pastor (also vicar general of the diocese) gave a good deal of support to the Byzantine community. He is an excellent woodworker and built the icon screen, if I remember correctly. He has always been there for us when we needed him. Since our Byzantine pastor is bi-ritual, we do require the support of the local RC diocese - and we always get it. As for my mother's bloomers, although one of my degrees is in music, I am also a weight lifter and in pretty good shape for my age. Could you live with the shame of being soundly beaten by a musician? :p

One should never leave home on special occasions without mothers best bloomer just in case you get run over and have to be taken to a hospital and therefore you will not bring shame upon your mother and her housekeeping when the nurses start cutting thru your clothes.

Those who are devotees of The Goon Show (naturally BBC) will understand all. It has it's origin in the days when the poorer folk would share clothes and from this it slipped into British humour.

However I am impressed that organist could probably handle a few more prostrations that most of us and go to the next Byzantine Church and do it all again.

ICXC
NIKA

Mateusz:

While I have not formally changed from the Roman Catholic Church to the Byzantine Catholic Church, I have been attending Divine Liturgy since last August. I was told that when I receive Communion in a Byzantine Church to approach the priest with arms crossed in the shape of St. Andrew's cross, and then tilt my head back.

I went to a Roman Catholic Mass recently and did just that. The priest had a puzzled look on his face and asked me if I wanted Communion or a Blessing. I said Communion, of course, but if he was giving out Blessings, I would take one of those too. I got both!

After Mass, I spoke with the priest who explained that people who only want to receive a Blessing, cross their chest with their arms. However, I also tilted my head back and extended my tongue to receive the Eucharist. That is what threw him for a loop.

I apologized and told him that I have been attending Divine Liturgy at the local Byzantine Catholic Church the past 8 or 9 months, and had just forgot the Roman Catholic custom. He asked me to stay, and we later had a nice discussion of the differences and the similarities between the Divine Liurgy and the Mass.

My advice: do whatever you feel comfortable with so long as it is respectful. I spend a lot of the time sitting in the pew instead of standing or kneeling because I have an irregular heartbeat. You could never tell by looking at me that I am disabled. Some folks probably thing I am a Protestant, but hopefully a respectful Protestant.

JP

I am latin rite, but a very eastern minded catholic.
Once I stayed nearly a year in the orthodox monastery of New Valaam (Uusi Valamo) here in Finland as a voluntery worker. I was serving the glergy of the holy monastery as a "ponomary" in the altar.
After hundreds of intensive sercives I adopted the eastern liturgical maners. And so still nowadays I do the sign of cross in the eastern way - everywhere...

i believe the benefit of crossing oneself and bowing according to the eastern tradition outweighs the slight confusion and "scandal" if you will to Latin parishioners because it may lead to them finding more about the eastern lung of the universal church(education). this is why ive decided to contine doing so. and hey why not? rosaries are allowed in an eastern rite church!