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Pope Benedict has called the Roman Catholic laity to make concrete gestures (genuine) to the Eastern Orthodox. What in particular can I do to accomplish this ?

I think that attending Divine Liturgies at Orthodox parishes, staying for coffee hour and talking with the Orthodox people, forming friendships etc These concrete things, in my opinion, will lead us closer to unity then many consultations with theologians. The Orthodox and Catholic people must get to know one another again!

I agree with Brian. Visit Orthodox parishes for services, meet Orthodox faithful, and learn about the Orthodox Church. Aside from Liturgy, Vespers on Saturday evenings is usually a good service to attend, especially if you have your own parish to attend on Sunday mornings. The downside is that, in many communities, Vespers is not heavily attended; the upside is that those who do attend are usually into their faith.

Dave

Yes there is a Sat nite Orthos What exactly is it? Please elaborate, and in fact I plan on going this Sat nite Thanks..

Orthros is the Matins Service and so it is kind of strange that it is served on Sat night. Usually, in a Slavic Parish (OCA, ROCOR etc), the service on Sat night is either the All Night Vigil (don't worry, it does not last all night in parishes!! which consists of Matins and Vespers or just Great Vespers is served. Orthros is usually celebrated in Greek and Antiochian parishes in the morning before Liturgy.

Just a thought as I feel the Holy Ghost move me.

Divine Litury is what the Novus Ordo Mass could have been like. I don't mean a copycat but something beautiful and reverent in the Western Church,in the vernacular, unlike a forced "liturgical development."

The Novus Ordo *CAN* be like that. Look at the mass on EWTN. And in some orthodox (little O)parishes in the US, you can and will find it.

There are a few parishes here in my area that are bringing back some of the beauty back into the mass - and stamping out the modernist agenda.

If one reads Sacrosanctum Concilliumyou can see that in the liturgical renewal, many things that are now lost in certain parishses were not intended to be lost. IE - the latin - some of the "unchangeable prayers" - like the sanctus, agnus dei, confeiteor, etc should be retained in latin.

In my opinion, there's a batch of priests out there in the roman world that follow this false "Spirit of Vatican II" ideal which in their minds gives them license to inject their own personal agendas into what THEY think the liturgy should be.

Your exactly right.


And I might correct myself they are having Vespers not Orthos tonight. Nice lady I spoke to said "come on down!"

If you'ld like to go to Vespers fairly often (and it's an excellent thing to do), you may also like to obtain a good pamphlet edition of the service, available from the St Vladimir's Seminary Bookstore and titled, oddly enough, "Vespers". Not too expensive and quite useful (the material for the eight tones of ordinary Saturday evenings is included).

Or, if you're really ambitious, you might want to obtain a copy of the Hapgood service-book, also available from the SVS bookstore and/or the Antiochian Orthodox Archdiocese, or Light and Life. More expensive, and a bit archaic (it's 100 years old, so that's hardly surprising), but still useful.

Light a candle for me!

Incognitus (and don't worry; God knows perfectly well who I am!)

OOps I overslept while taking a nap. I just called St. George's Orthodox Cathedral , they are having a Vespers tonight at 6 , I am going to that one , do I need to dress up ?? Hurry and answer me !!!(Antionchene, I believe also )

Be clean and neat...ideally, pants and shoes and shirt, not jeans and sneakers....and never shorts...but Antiochians are more casual...jeans can work.

Gaudior, in haste

Thanks that is kind of what I had in mind. Off to Vespers !!

Well I get there at 6 and there is a huge limosine in front of the church with tons of cars in the lot!
A wedding just got over and the people were walking out. Being the curious sort that I am, I walk in and the bride and groom are up front with the photographers. I did not see a priest around so I hung in the back of the church just nodding at people like I attended the wedding!!! Oh well, next week at the church closer to me or there again. St. George's in Wichita is a beautiful church on the east side of town. Best regards and I will go next week!!!!!!!!!!!

One of the things I find interesting is that the Orthodox Churches never seem to have had a "spirit of Vatican II" problem that I'm aware of.

In fact the only major liturgical problems of that scope that I know of in the Orthodox Churches were the Iconoclast persecutions and the revision of the Russian liturgy in the 1700s or 1800s. (I'm not sure on the dates for the Russian revision.)

Are there any Orthodox who would care to comment? Specifically, have there been any Vatican II type crises in the history of Orthodox liturgy?

--John