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My wife and I, both Roman Rite Catholics, recently attended a Byzantine Catholic Church and fell in love with it instantly. We are not sure if we want to convert to the Byzantine Rite (although this is a possibility), but we definitely want to go back. I have some questions I would like to ask any of you who would like to answer them. Thank you in advance for your time, sincerity, and good faith.

In Christ,
Marc

1) The Byzantine priest mentioned in his sermon that Byzantine Catholics fare better statistically with respect to Sunday Mass attendance. Are there any figures on fidelity to the Church's teachings? I am particularly interested in finding out how many Byzantine Catholics co-habit before marriage and contracept in comparison to their Roman brethren.

2) I know that infants receive communion in the Byzantine Church in the form of a drop of blood. At some point, as you all know, infants graduate to solids, but how is the priest to know when a baby is ready for solids with regard to receiving the Body of Christ? Do the parents have to give some sort of "signal" to the priest?

3) How does Canon Law work in the Byzantine Church? How do marriage/annulment tribunals work? Are the laws and process the same as the Roman Rite?

4) Do Byzantine Catholic parents prefer to home school or send their children to Roman Catholic schools (since I am understand that Byzantine Catholic schools do not exist), not that there are any laws either way....I am just curious.

5) For about 11 seconds I kicked around the idea to converting to the Tridentine Rite, but a friend of mine warned me of the difficulties of raising my chilrdren in a "narrow world". I live in Texas, where there are only 3 Byzantine Catholic Churches in the entire state. What do you think of my friend's comment? It seems that even if we convert to the Byzantine Rite, we should expose our children to the Roman Rite for practical reasons at least (i.e., increasing marriage prospects for our children).

6) Are Byzantine Catholics witnessing more and more Roman Catholics converting to the Byzantine Rite as a result of the pedophilia scandals?

7) Someone said that the Eastern Churches do not see very much homosexuality in the priesthood because the Eastern Churches are more mystical and hence more masculine. I think I agree with this although I cannot explain why. Your thoughts?

8) Our reasons for falling in love with Byzantium are more the beauty and reverence of the Liturgy. One thing I can't stand is priests/deacons whose sermons consist more of their private fluffy opinions rather than solid theology and pastoral advice that is truly geared to helping me become a saint. My general impressions tell me that Byzantium offers more of the latter than the former. From your experience, is this consistent from parish to parish in the Byzantine Church?

9) A priest friend advised us to decoarate our home such that it looks like we are Catholic (e.g., crucifixes, statues of Mary). If one puts up Eastern crufixes, icons, etc., how does one send the message to guests that one is Eastern Catholic rather than Eastern Orthodox?

I realize I have so many questions; please feel free to answer only those you have time to answer

God bless

Dear Friend in Christ,

Welcome and Happy New Year!

I'll take a stab at your questions!

1) While I have no idea what the statistics are, but a general rule is that Byzantine Catholics tend to be more conservative than Latin Catholics with respect to observing the Church precepts and teachings. Our conservative character is rooted in our ages-old fidelity to Tradition, the Councils of the early Church and liturgical worship that derives from the Holy Fathers of the East. We don't change with time in this respect, although this doesn't mean we don't have a sense of humour during coffee fellowship after the Liturgy!

2) Children up to the age of seven receive Communion in our Churches without Confession and receive their first Communion along with the Mysteries (Sacraments) of Initiation of Baptism, Chrismation and Communion. The priest places just a little of the Consecrated Wine, the Precious Blood of Christ into the infant's mouth and the infants receive this only for the first few years - common sense should rule.

3) We have our own Canon Law and our own tribunals etc. The way things work is similar, but I certainly hope that our Churches don't follow the deplorable example of the Latin Church in North America in granting annulments to couples on the basis of psychological reports etc.!

4) Well, I attended Latin Catholic primary and secondary schools while my parents insisted on as full a liturgical participation in our Church's services and traditions as possible. Creeping Latinization, you know . . . In the civilized part of the world where I live, the school Eastern Catholic parents send their children to is assessed in terms of its education standards, but we do have our own Ukrainian Catholic daytime schools that are fully accredited with our public school boards. You should consider moving to Canada, perhaps?

5) As for the Tridentine Rite, things could be "narrower," - you could have thought about joining an Old Calendarist Orthodox jurisdiction . There is nothing wrong with your children growing up with RC's or even, do I dare even mention it . . .marrying one of them . . . . They could always convert (not your children, their partners). Perhaps you could find a priest like the one I read about in Uganda who told the girls in the school he taught that "if you bring me a (husband)convert, I pay for your marriage."

6) I think that RC's who are personally shocked over the scandals will do any number of things in response, including even apostatize. We now have an organization of formerly Catholic Apostates who promote pamphlets where you can sign to declare your apostasy from Catholicism. Certainly, becoming Eastern Catholic is to be preferred . . .

7) The Eastern Churches don't see much homosexuality in the priesthood since so many of our priests are married . . . to women. Consequently, "scandalous behaviour" in the Ukrainian Catholic Church is usually when a priest refuses to eat perogies in public prepared by the Women's Guild. The East has always had a married priesthood, from Apostolic times, ever since St Peter's mother-in-law was cured of a fever and immediately got up and served our Lord and the Apostles. Mothers-in-law do have an important purpose after all . Our bishops are chosen from among monastic clergy, usually, but some of the really memorable bishops were from the celibate parish clergy. They have women serving them hand and foot ever after anyway.

8) Again, our theology is very much based on Patristics and the teachings of our saints regarding Theosis. You Latins don't have this in your theology. It is about how Christ transfigures us in the Holy Spirit through prayer, sacraments and Life in Him and "Divinizes" us, making us Christ-like. We have a less individualistic focus on "make me a saint" and more of an orientation on the Church/Communion of Saints through which we participate in the Body of Christ and receive His sanctifying and deifying transformation in Him. But don't worry, the more you enter into this great Mystery, the greater the likelihood you WILL be a saint!

9) In terms of liturgical/ritual identity, Orthodox and Eastern Catholics are IDENTICAL. We have the SAME icons, saints etc. We are truly "Orthodox in communion with Rome" and Popes have told us to follow the ideal "nec plus, nec minus, nec aliter." Originally, the Orthodox Catholic Church of the East was in full communion with the West and with you-know-who in St Peter's Chair. We are simply Orthodox Catholics with that restored communion. You can always put up a picture of Pope John Paul II, if you are concerned that people will confuse you with the Orthodox (but away from the icons, at least for now). But somehow, I don't think that's going to happen . . .

Alex

Hi:

You don't have to "convert" between the Latin Catholic Church and any other Catholic Church Sui Iuris. We are in full communion.

This might seem to be a little issue, but I think the rest of your post indicates you have the impression that the differences between our spiritual and liturgical traditions are divisive, rather than complementary.

1) Mass Attendance.

I don't have any solid numbers. I'd say that if the Byzantines are doing better than us Romans, it is not by much.

The Parish I visit, which is none other than the Cathedral of St. Mary in Van Nuys, has a very stable and very compact group of parishoners attending Mass.

It is very unlikely these are all the Byzantine Ruthenian Catholics in the area. Especially when "the area" is the entire North part of the LA-metro area up to and including Santa Barbara and further north.

What I do know is that in Ukraine, the number of Catholics attending Sunday Liturgy is fairly equal to the number of Orthodox attending Liturgy. But, the Orthodox population of Ukraine is several times larger than the Catholic population, and accordingly, the proportion of Catholic attendance is several times higher than the proportion of Orthodox attendance.

2) Infant Communion.

Common sense is the norm.

3) Judicial processes.

The procedures are mostly the same. The Code of Canon Law, of course, might be slightly different.

4) School.

I really don't know.

Personally, I would NEVER home-school, unless I expect my children to home-work and to marry each other (which is quite difficult, considering I have two sons and only one daughter, that would be difficult even if we moved to Utah ).

If my children live in a real world, they must be prepared to deal with it as soon as possible. That doesn't mean that we as parents are not in charge of the education of our children.

5.1) "Converting" to the Tridentine Rite.

Again, those parishes and societies lawfully using the Tridentine Rite are an integral part of the Latin Catholic Church, so there is no need of conversion.

5.2) "Exposing children to the Roman Rite for practical reasons at least (i.e., increasing marriage prospects for our children)."

Everybody stay calm, I will not comment on this one, except to say that I think you should revise why are you attending Church in the first place, you might be missing the point alltogether.

Well, I did comment on that one! Darn!

6) Pedophilia scandals.

Byzantine Catholics (and Eastern Orthodox, contrary to what has been previously said here) also have their share in the issue.

Again, if someone leaves the Church just because the Church has a problem, then good riddance. That person was part of the problem. I'd like the Church to keep only the members that are willing to work really hard for the salvation of the world.

For everybody else there is a HUGE market of spirituoid thingies out there.

7) Homosexuality among Eastern priests.

Again, they do have their share in the problem, they just don't get as much TV prime time as our own boys do.

8) Sermons.

My experience is very limited, but indeed, the Byzantine priests I know seem to be much more concerned about the theological and pastoral solidity of their sermons, as opposed to their emotional and sentimental impact than the Roman priest I know, especially here in the U.S.

The Byzantine priests I know would rank just about average compared the Roman priests I know from Mexico, though. It might be an American cultural thing, more than a "ritual" thing.

9) How do you tell Eastern Catholic from Eastern Orthodox?

The Pope and The Immaculate Conception (there *are* Byzantine Catholic icons with this motif) would be a good starting point. Post-1054 saints would also help, for the educated guest.

But I'd ask: Why is it so important to draw the line, when the line is already so thin?

Shalom,
Memo.

My turn, but just a few of them

I think your priest took some licence. Those statistics would show the opposite, that Byzantines fare less better with Sunday attendence.

As mentioned, Byzantine Catholics have had their fair share of pedophile priests.

Certainly among the laity its not difficult finding gay people among non-ethnic Ruthenian Catholics and in the OCA. Russian Catholics get the award for the highest proportion of gay members, with Ukrainians the least.

The sermon is not an essential part of the Eastern liturgy. It can be properly omitted or some parishes give it after the Liturgy. We do have some great Eastern Christian preachers, but this is due from latinization.

If your guests need to know this information, you tell them. Polite people don't ask about some one else's denomination, however.

Axios

Dear Marc:

Within the Catholic Church you may make yourself at home in any parish and receive the sacraments or mysteries without "conversion" because there is no conversion. We are all brothers and sisters in Christ; we are in communion.

I believe that the term you are searching for is "translation of rites" if you are referring to the formal, legal change needed so that you were recognized as a member of the particular parish, e.g. Byzantine Catholic, if you were originally baptized in a Latin Catholic parish. There are times when a translation of rites might be useful--if you were a regular attendee of a Byzantine parish but not formally a member. We all need to be a member of a parish somewhere. Not having a translation of rites and being a regular attendee of a Byzantine parish but having no formal membership anywhere may pose a problem if you are asked at some point to be a sponsor at Baptism or want to be an official witness at a wedding.

You need to talk to the parish priest of the parish in which you wish to belong, whether Byzantine or Latin.

BOB

Dear Marc, I would think that anybody considering "converting" to something after spending one hour on a Sunday morning with that community and knowing apparently nothing else about that community's ethos, history, or way of life needs to stop, take a breath, and get a better sense of who they themselves are and figure out what makes them ready to jump off into the unknown after only that long.

Axios, what exactly would be our "fair share" of sexually abusive priests? Is our ~3 public cases among the Ruthenians out of our few hundred priests in the whole country our "fair share"? Rather, I think it is ~3 too many. No Church has a "fair share" of this kind of betrayal.

But isn't the Byzantine Church (e.g., in Russia) the church of the "babas"/"babushkas" (old women)? Isn't the Byzantine Tradition the Marian tradition par excellence? Doesn't sound like mystical="masculine" in this case. (I guess homosexual men are by your definition "not masculine")

Without going into Axios's sundry details (based on only his own evidence, apparently), if somebody is "looking out" for homosexual people in a church, if you're apt to see a "poof in every pew" or a "homo in every homily", you're bound to be repulsed by the Byzantine Church too. Statistically speaking, we are a reflection of American society, for better or worse. We don't throw gay people out of our churches, nor do we put up a welcome sign. Our "welcome sign" is our Tradition, our Faith, our heritage and our Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ.

"Decorate" your home so that it pleases you and use religious objects that will draw you closer to God in prayer and holiness. As far as what messages you're sending to your guests: live ("decorate") your life in a way that they will know you are a Christian.

I never heard of such a question like you ask about sending messages that you are Eastern Catholic versus Eastern Orthodox. First of all, you are not an Eastern Catholic, so unless you have decided after prayer, participation and time to become one, you are years ahead of yourself. Become more secure in what you already are, and if that doesn't work for you, then give the Byzantine way of life a chance--over a few years. It is not the mere changing of "Rite"--it is the acceptance of and assimilation into a complete way of Christian life. Worrying about whether you're sending signals about "Eastern Catholic" vs. "Eastern Orthodox" will only prolong/delay your integration into an Eastern Catholic community, because for us these distinctions are so minor as to be rendered meaningless in the context of how one places religious objects in one's home.

I would hope that you will find welcome and peace among our Byzantine Catholics, but please reconsider exactly why it is you want to be among them. Your questions sound like you're running away from something and not being attracted to something. And I fear that what you think you are running to is not at all what you are actually going to find. God bless you.

You are right. One is too many. I was too loose in my choice of terms.

Axios

Dear Theophan,
The canonical term is "Transfer of sui iuris Church." "Rite" is not a canonical term as applied to individuals, that is, a Rite is not something a person is a member of. A Rite is the spiritual tradition that is used by a particular Church, for example, the Ruthenian Church uses the Byzantine Rite.

Dear Marc:

I will attempt to answer your questions:

1) The Byzantine priest mentioned in his sermon that Byzantine Catholics fare better statistically with respect to Sunday Mass attendance. Are there any figures on fidelity to the Church's teachings? I am particularly interested in finding out how many Byzantine Catholics co-habit before marriage and contracept in comparison to their Roman brethren.

This is a baited question and presumes that a Church is responsible for its members. The truth is that all Byzantine Churches are comprised of sinners, just like the Roman Catholic Church.

2) I know that infants receive communion in the Byzantine Church in the form of a drop of blood. At some point, as you all know, infants graduate to solids, but how is the priest to know when a baby is ready for solids with regard to receiving the Body of Christ? Do the parents have to give some sort of "signal" to the priest?

A lot of common sense is utilized. Roman Catholics seem to have an oversensitivity regarding the "body" and reception by young children. The truth of the matter is they do as well as anyone else. Of course, Scripture teaches that they are more properly disposed for reception than us sinning adults.

3) How does Canon Law work in the Byzantine Church? How do marriage/annulment tribunals work? Are the laws and process the same as the Roman Rite?

We have our own Canon Law but for the average lay person, there is no real essential difference between East and West.

4) Do Byzantine Catholic parents prefer to home school or send their children to Roman Catholic schools (since I am understand that Byzantine Catholic schools do not exist), not that there are any laws either way....I am just curious.

Byzantine Catholics send their kids to public schools, private schools Roman, Byzantine Catholic, Orthodox, or otherwise. Some do choose to home school.

5) For about 11 seconds I kicked around the idea to converting to the Tridentine Rite, but a friend of mine warned me of the difficulties of raising my chilrdren in a "narrow world". I live in Texas, where there are only 3 Byzantine Catholic Churches in the entire state. What do you think of my friend's comment? It seems that even if we convert to the Byzantine Rite, we should expose our children to the Roman Rite for practical reasons at least (i.e., increasing marriage prospects for our children).

This is a strange question. One joins a Church, a particular parish, because that is where they find the true faith. Why would you then need to expose your children to a more common faith if one tastes the real thing. (I am not saying that the Roman Catholics do not find the true faith. I just question why you would consider changing Churches if you did.) Did the early Christians fraternize with the pagans so that they could increase their marital prospects?

6) Are Byzantine Catholics witnessing more and more Roman Catholics converting to the Byzantine Rite as a result of the pedophilia scandals?

I think most committed Catholics recognize "the sheep from the goats." They are offended by the predator priests and disenchanted with their heirarchy. But they know that the Church is all of the faithful. Scandal within the Church is nothing new. The fidelity of the laity has always been more important than the indescretions of its clergy.

I suspect that those who are nominally practicing Catholics will simply stop attending any church.

Furthermore, most evangelical protestants will tell you that those who join a church for reasons other than a true identification with the faith will not stay very long.

7) Someone said that the Eastern Churches do not see very much homosexuality in the priesthood because the Eastern Churches are more mystical and hence more masculine. I think I agree with this although I cannot explain why. Your thoughts?

This is another baited question. Our priests are sinners! All priests are sinners.

8) Our reasons for falling in love with Byzantium are more the beauty and reverence of the Liturgy. One thing I can't stand is priests/deacons whose sermons consist more of their private fluffy opinions rather than solid theology and pastoral advice that is truly geared to helping me become a saint. My general impressions tell me that Byzantium offers more of the latter than the former. From your experience, is this consistent from parish to parish in the Byzantine Church?

Yet another baited question. Our clergy are not better than anyone else. We are not better than the laity; we are not better than other clergy. The only thing we can say is that God is pleased with our sacrifice which he accepts at the hands of our priests.

9) A priest friend advised us to decoarate our home such that it looks like we are Catholic (e.g., crucifixes, statues of Mary). If one puts up Eastern crufixes, icons, etc., how does one send the message to guests that one is Eastern Catholic rather than Eastern Orthodox?

It is not important that others be able to distinguish whether you are Orthodox or Catholic. Those external things you list do not make one Byzantine anyway. They may make your house look that way, but of themselves they do nothing for you.

The Byzantine journey is a journey within oneself. We are transformed by our intimate relationship with the Holy Spirit. That is what all that matters.

As we prepare for the feast of the Theophany let us recall the Forerunner, John the Baptist. His entire message was that the externals were not important. We need to die and to be born again in Christ. Repent! For the kingdom of God is at hand!

You will recall that this baptism leaves no external marks. It is not about a physical cleansing either. It is about forgiveness of sins and about a true desire to live in communion with God. This is what being a Christian is about, and it has nothing to do with being Eastern or Western.

Fr. Dcn John

Dear Friends,

And I wondered what else could be said after my post!

Alex

Christ is Baptized!

Marc,

I recommend attending your local Byzantine parish for at least a year. This will give you a good demonstration of Eastern life and praxis through the various Liturgical cycles. Most of the questions you asked will be answered in that time by talking with the parishoners and observing how we do things. Enjoy the experience and pray that our Lord leads you where you need to be.

Dmitri

Perhaps if the availability of Byzantine Catholic Churches is an issue you may be able to find a Maronite Catholic Church near you.

The Maronites are of the "West Syrian" liturgical heritage rather than Byzantine. They have their own Liturgy which is different than ours'.

http://www.eparchyla.org/parishes.htm

http://www.eparchyla.org/

With Best Wishes for a blessed Theophany!
Stefan-Ivan

Hi Marc,

I am a Ukrainian Greek Catholic from Allen, TX - not very far from you. I am very pleased to see your interest in the Byzantine tradition. You would be happy to note, though, that there are many more than just 3 Byzantine options in the state.

For example, our Ukrainian Greek Catholic parish (St. Sophia) is located in The Colony and we have many parishioners who come from Irving (and, as a matter of fact, from Ft. Worth, Dallas, and as far away as Louisiana). Although our church is just barely two years old, we are very proud of our church and I would like to extend to you a warm invitation to come join us. Easily half if not more of our parishioners are not Ukrainian, much less from a Byzantine tradition, and I feel you would find ourself among friends.

If you are interested, please feel free to contact me and I can help you through your journey of dicovery of our rich heritage. Maybe we can get together for a face-to-face chat and see how things go from there.

May God bless you and your family and guide to do His will. Christos narodyvshya! Slavite Yoho!

Dear Lemko Rusyn:

I apologize if the term that I supplied was dated. When I asked about the possibility of such a move myself about 30 years ago, this was the term that was used.

Actually, "translation" and "transfer" come from the same Latin roots so that part cannot be far off.

On the other hand, I was told at that time that this type of change in one's canonical status had to be sent in a petition to Rome for approval. Is that still the case?

At that time, too, the terminology was still "rite" to describe the various local churches that make up the Catholic Church united under the Roman Pontiff.

BOB

P.S.: Thanks for the update. Wishing you and your family a blessed Christmas season.

Hello:

That is the law, yes.

However, in territories where the Latin Church is dominant, such as Western Europe and the American Continent, there is a pastoral provision to allow the involved ordinaries to take Rome's approval for granted, and usually such petitions are not even sent.

Some sort of Catholic Economy? Seems so!

Shalom,
Memo.