www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Miles Jesu.

Has anybody here heard of Miles Jesu? What do you think of them?

Last night I went to confession and Mass at the founding Miles Jesu community (founded in Phoenix).

Anyways, I guess that they are bi-ritual, they had an iconostasis in the Church (it was quite interesting to attend a Novus Ordo Mass with an iconostasis), we also prayed the pre-communion prayer of St. John Chrysostom before receiving.

I also talked to one of the consecrated lay members of the community, and he just got back from a hard-core retreat at Holy Transfiguration skete in Michigan.

So, anyways, I was just wondering if anybody has heard of them, or had interactions with them.

Dear Made for Communion,

No, I haven't heard of them, but by your description they sound interesting. Do they have a web page?

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+

Also one of the members, upon finding out that I am interested in the Byzantine rite also told me, that they are becoming more and more popular in the Ukraine and that Patriarch Husar, has made them a province (or something like that).

Do you have any idea what this means?

They used to have a house in Virginia, and I visited in the early 80s, stayed a week or so. I don't know if they still do this, but at that time when they traveled they went two by two, hitch-hiking, which I thought the epitome of mendicant travel!
My impression was that they were a very evangelical [in the best sense] Catholic group.
-Daniel

From the about [milesjesu.com] page:

I know what that sounds like.

Andrew

I know what that sounds like.

Will someone please explain to me the Orthodox Church's position on evangelizing to Christians, especially with regard to Catholics? I have been following it for years and can't make heads or tails out of it. I see quotes like the above constantly but I have been personally asked to foresake Catholicism for Eastern Orthodoxy. Now there are two clear options here. Either we are not going to evangelize to eachother or we are. If the Orthodox are going to continue to complain about Catholic missions in the East then they should not be evangelizing to Catholics in the West. Period. Otherwise, we should just be honest with eachoher and continue with mutual evangelism.

On a personal note, I am fine with either solution, just so long as everyone is clear on it. I just want to avoid a double standard.

I was thinking the same thing, aren't there many Eastern Orthodox who are former Eastern Catholics here in the US?

The church has to be patient and check the credentials of those of the clergy who have indicated they want to come over to the Catholic Church. Some who have claimed to be orthodox were ordained by Underground Church bishops whose credentials were a bit unclear. One of the bishops who wanted to come over in Ukraine or Russia ended up in Australia and went into the Anglican Church the last I heard. In the past to some priests regretted their move and went back to the orthodox and then wanted to come over to the Catholics a second time. However, Rome expects at that point they come over as laymen. We had one like that also in Australia. He was taken in by a Russian parish run by the Greeks and when he was buried the funeral was attended by Rocor clergy and the Russian Catholics clergy.

Matt

I don�t know that I�ve ever seen a single across the board policy that articulates the church�s position. I do know there was input from several of the major churches in the Balamand Statement [orthodoxwiki.org] . The link to the statement also has a link to this page [oca.org] on the OCA site with some relevant information given by Fr. John Matusiak. I also noticed in a recent interview with His Grace Bishop Nikon of the OCA the following statement in response to an interview question:
I can tell you what my personal experience is. I attend an Orthodox Mission in a part of the country with a large Catholic population. We meet literally a block away from a large Catholic parish. We do not at this time have any contacts with them, nor would we attempt to pull people away from that parish. Certainly we would accept anybody who decided Orthodoxy was where they needed to be, but we certainly don�t engage in any sort of organized activity to convert Catholics nor would we trumpet conversions as some sort of mechanism to bring the East and West together.

Also in our parish we have two Roman Catholics who have Orthodox spouses. They attend every week and in most every way are members of the parish. They have been doing that for years. Father doesn�t treat them differently, and he doesn�t pressure them to convert.
That is what I would call the Amway approach, and I doubt if it would be a very effective tool for reaching people. Coincidentally, it has been suggested to me before that I do the opposite as was suggested to you.

I was also an observer quite recently to an ongoing conversation elsewhere among some Roman Catholics about the various errors and problems with Orthodoxy. It was not so subtly suggested that those who come in to contact with the truth, i.e. the claims about the Roman Catholic Church about itself, and do not become Catholic will have something to answer for.

Well, I�m being honest. Going by what I have read and what I have experienced I know of no organized, overt effort to bring Catholics in to the Orthodox Church. Until very recently most Orthodox churches in the west were not interested for the most part in reaching out to anybody outside of their source communities. Certainly that continues to exist as a popular stereotype. The growing use of English here in the United States for example has changed how the church interacts with the non Orthodox. Even then, I would say the Orthodox approach is one of come and see and not go and get.

I don�t know what to make of your statement that we should be honest with each other and continue mutual evangelism otherwise. Taken at face value, I would think you regard the statement I originally quoted from Miles Jesu the way it struck me; as an overt and organized attempt to seek conversions of Orthodox believers to Catholicism in a manner that to my mind is in direct opposition to what is in the Balamand Statement. What�s troubling to me is they appear to be an organization with official support unlike the Transalpine Redemporists.

Andrew

Andrew, You may very well be the first Orthodox on the forum - as long as I've been posting here - to consider the Balamand Statement as anything other than a dead letter.

Well, it was certainly never an official position ratified by the church as a whole. That's what I think Fr. John's comments point to. I think it was the ecclesiological implications of the statement more than anything else that was controversial within Orthodoxy.

I posted it because it shows at least in the recent past that Orthodox leaders were willing to publicly say they weren�t going to go after Catholics. Even if the statement itself is a dead letter (and it may very well be), I don�t think that means that there has been a reversal regarding that aspect of the statement. I personally believe it has not for the other reasons I outlined.

Do Catholics consider it a dead letter? Are Orthodox Christians being targeted for conversion?

Andrew

Hello,

The Miles Jesu's discription of Byzantine Rite is GROSSLY ERRONEOUS! WOW! Very bad discription.

Byzantine Church is not a Byzantine Rite of Roman Catholic Church.

WOW!

Could somebody, with better English, information and proven facts write them an email to give a friendly correction to their bad information about the Byzantine Church and the Byzantine Rite.

Please let us know who has done that and what the responses are.

Many thanks,

SPDundas
Deaf Byzantine

Without trying to incur even more wrath I thought I might make one more comment. I noticed in the opening a post a reference to a service that appears to be a mixture of a Novus Ordo mass and a divine liturgy, or at least includes prayers from the DL. Are bi-ritual priests allowed to do that? If allowed, are such things encouraged or seen as prudent to do?

Andrew

Do Catholics consider it a dead letter? Are Orthodox Christians being targeted for conversion?

Andrew, thanks for your thoughtful reply. I think most (not all) Catholics would agree to not targeting the Orthodox for conversion. I also think the Vatican is willing to adopt the position. I just think it should be equal all the way around. I am a big believer in Byzantine Catholicism and would like to see it grow, but not at the expense of the Eastern Orthodox. I still hope for reunion between the two churches and I think open evangelism would, just practically speaking, put a big damper on that cause. It could create a lot of two way animosity. Opening up evangelism would seem to more or less "give up the ghost" on reunion. And I am not willing to do that yet. Unfortunately, there seem to be quite a few people on both sides who would welcome it.