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Mar 25th, 2025
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Joined: Nov 2001
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Bless, Father Deacon! In fact, the Ukie Church today acts as if it is already a patriarchate (the upstarts!). What is happening though, and I've seen it with my own eyes, is that when the Synod appoints a bishop (in this case, our own Vladyka Stephen), Rome takes its time approving it, as it to show "Not so fast, upstarts! We'll show you Slavic "kabanie" who is boss here!"  (Or, in Polish, "Psiakref Rusinie!"  ) Major Archbishop - shamajor archbishop - the papal nuncio took extra pains at the consecration of our new Vladyka to underscore that it was HE and HE ALONE that is charged with the responbility to appoint new bishops for us. With a patriarchate, we'll be united because even our Basilianist Catholics will acknowledge it, we can continue to appoint our own bishops etc. and inform Rome after the fact and otherwise take fuller control of what is already ours. His Beatitude Lubomyr also did something by way of flexing his patriarchal muscles when, following the translation of the Relics of the Holy Hieromartyr Nicholas Charnetsky, he appointed a feast-day for it - something that is usually, in our Church, reserved to Rome. Even when we have our patriarchate, the struggle would continue for the direct authority of the patriarch over the diaspora without Rome's encroachments, and even for the ancient right to canonize our own saints! Perhaps our future patriarch will canonize saints for the Ruthenian Church too, if it would like. And with all the children you have, Father Deacon, you would definitely qualify for the "martyr" level Alex
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Joined: Dec 2001
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Father Deacon John and Alex...
I am guessing that what we are talking about is the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church??
I am reading up on the situation now
http://www.ugcc.org.ua/eng/press-releases/article;679/
(what a wonderful letter!)
I see that Moscow is involved. We know their motivations.
Speaking of coincidences... In our discussion regarding apparitions and such, I made note that apparitions of the Virgin have been numerous in the Ukraine. I now make note that often this type of - increase - in any area - is a preparation for spiritual upheavals and dark times (dark in the way of confusion and a test of faith). The Good Lord gives some extra �food� to fortify his children as they pass though.
From my reading Alex, it seems to me that the Pope has and is working very diligently to give full birth to your Church in a very protective way so that it will survive. If democracy fails there - and the Bear reasserts its domain - full independence from Moscow and full independence from Rome - leaves the Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church as weak prey. If democracy fails - they will then look to crush you. If that happens then only strong ties with Moscow or Rome - will save you physically. And of course one way is preferable to the other way.
-ray
-ray
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Joined: Nov 2001
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Dear RayK,
Yes, absolutely!
As Shakespeare said, "Rome and roome enough!"
Alex
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Joined: Dec 2001
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
Yes, absolutely!
Alex Well - any thoughts of me helping - have vanished like vapor. The least I can do is make a pilgramage to the local Ukrainian Church, which, as New England would have it, seems to be only a few towns over, a 45 minute drive to Ansonia. If it is open I will got inside and if it is not I will sit outside and offer my presence for the intentions of the Ukrainian Church. -ray
-ray
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Joined: Nov 2001
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Dear RayK, Some of the best friends the Ukrainian Catholic Church has are Roman Catholics and specialists in Eastern Theology. As a matter of fact, they know Eastern Theology better than we do! God bless, Alex
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Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 264
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
As Shakespeare said, "Rome and roome enough!"
Hello! Please tell me where this quote comes from. It's charming!
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Joined: Oct 2003
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Originally posted by Booth: Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
[b]As Shakespeare said, "Rome and roome enough!"
Please tell me where this quote comes from. It's charming! [/b]Booth, It's a slightly modified line from Shakespeare's Julius Caesar, the fuller text reads: Originally posted by William Shakespeare (or whomever among the literary lights of the time that you believe authored the works attributed to him):
Now in the names of all the Gods at once,
Upon what meate doth this our Caesar feede,
That he is growne so great? Age, thou art sham'd.
Rome, thou hast lost the breed of Noble Bloods.
When went there by an Age, since the great Flood,
But it was fam'd with more then with one man?
When could they say (till now) that talk'd of Rome,
That her wide Walkes incompast but one man?
Now is it Rome indeed, and Roome enough
When there is in it but one onely man.
Many years, Neil
"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
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Patriarchal Sobor?
Looks like plans to me!
Stephanos I
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