www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Prayer I'm really sorry to ask this, but I need your help

Hi guys,
I hope this is the right forum? At any rate, prayer can't hurt. I was wondering if someone or someones could help me. Sometimes (all the time, rather) I just hate God. I hope I don't have to confess that? Does anyone else out there feel like that sometimes, like you just can't stand Him? I know the line about the clay not questioning the potter why he made it the way he did (or however that line goes), but I really am angry at God for making me the way He did...I am such an idiot all the time, I am constantly embarrassed by myself and all day long I feel intense shame, even from things I did a couple years ago. And these aren't necessarily sins, more like social faux paxs, or me just being really immature. What good could possibly come of me tripping all over myself all the time? I just don't know why God allows me to act the way I do...
I used to like going to church, but now I'm always tempted not to go. I do go, but I always feel like I am fighting off sleep. I hate hearing about how God loves us, blah blah blah it makes me really angry! I wish He wouldn't have mercy on us, we don't deserve it, and the whole concept really ticks me off! I was reading part of St. Faustina's diary (forgive me, I'm a Latin:) ) and it just made me really angry, like when Jesus was saying His greatest attribute is mercy, or that it hurts Him when souls don't trust in His mercy. I just wanted to scream, "You idiot! Why are You merciful? You shouldn't be, you don't have a right to be, I hate You, etc."
And to top it all off, everyone around me thinks I am this (overly) religious person who is just perfectly happy with her religion, getting lots of consolation from it and exhibiting a great faith. Ha! I have no faith, anything remotely resembling it is probably an obsession.
And deep down, I think I really do know that the whole point of it is, we DON'T deserve mercy and that's what makes God so great, and I think it probably does make Him upset that I think like this, that I don't trust in His mercy.
So, if anyone could just pray that I somehow get out of this hellhole and manage to stay out of the real Hell, I'd appreciate it.
Thanks,
Laura

Laura,

This the right place for your request. First, what comes to mind is the simple prayer "Lord help me in my unbelief to believe". Repeatedly said in sincerity it is always answered.

Second, we all at one point or another enter that spiritual desert that you describe. It really is not uncommon, but it is a way of tempering us spiritually. I had my period over twenty years ago and it took a lot to overcome it. One thing I do recall is I was never abandoned by God, just me abandoning Him. When I finally came out of that dark period, it was like the Prodigal Son being welcomed by the father. I had to lie in the mire and be starved for the fulness that I was depriving myself of, mainly through pride.

It was definitely a very trying and spiritually void time for me, but something within would not let me abandon God entirely. I am not going to say that it has been easy since, for that would not be truthful. It has helped me though by the experience to take on many of the spiitual trials of my vocation and to try to have and teach the compassion of our Lord and live by His teachings. That is not as easy as it sounds.

We will pray for you, and ask God to help you with your unbelief. Remember as Christians we are enjoined by Saint Paul in his epistle to the Thessalonians, "Encourage one another and build each other up"

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+

Laura

You're in my prayers, and I admit that lately I've been feeling the same way too. Not too surprisingly a close friend also admitted to me that she also had similar feelings. Apparently you are not the only one, BUT yes, that doesn't make things any easier.

This is on the light side but may help. I get these email encouragements each day. We can all use them.

"If you had a friend who talked to you like you sometimes talk to yourself, would you continue to hang around with that person?"

Father's encouragement is best. We go through dark nights of the soul, as St. John of the Cross wrote, but they are there to build us up. Perhaps you are being prepared for extraordiary spiritual adventures.

CDL

Prayers !

Laura

We all go through these times .

I had a period of about 8 months when I felt I could not pray - it was one of those arid times - I doubted everyone and everything. In despair I spoke to a young Priest and his comment was

" Don't worry - it will come back all right. Now you have told me about it I won't worry about you - yes I'll support you and pray for you - but I won't worry. You see - I think it's a sign of increasing maturity - you are growing up spiritually . I worry about those who say they don't have problems . They do - but they haven't realised that they have. Just hang on - and when you can , ask God to help you."

He was right - it did pass but it took a long time

Prayers for you

Dear Laura,

With prayerful support in this dark time! I am so sorry you are going through this trial, but it is only for a time. I pray that you will come through swiftly, emerge strengthened by the ordeal.

the unworthy,
Elias

Thanks guys!

Dear Lasha,

I too experience overwhelming temptations that embarrass me. I think to myself, "I'm not the good person I like other people to consider me as, I'm really rotten etc." That too is all part of the enemy's plan . . . And, yes, he is an enemy and he's real.

My combat advice, fellow soldier, is simply this:

1) Don't accept it as something that comes from you - it does not.

2) Don't feel guilt over it because that is what the evil one wants us to feel so he can crush us further.

3) Whenever a rationalized thought comes to mind to justify this feeling, counter it with a conscious thought to overturn it - as best you can.

4) Stop thinking about it at that point when the temptation comes.

5) Turn immediately to the Jesus Prayer using prayer beads or what you have. Keep praying it until the temptation melts away - and it will.

I suffered a temptation to do something against my health as a diabetic. It seemed perfectly reasonable to me at the time and I really wanted to do this thing.

I knew it was wrong, however, and I began to rationalize it out saying, "Well, God doesn't expect us to do things that we don't have the strength to do, it would only be a small sin etc."

NO! THAT doesn't come from us either!

We need to implore the Grace of Christ in the Jesus Prayer, the Psalms, the Rosary what have you - and not give up until our enemy decides to leave the battlefield of our soul.

The worst enemy here is pride in thinking we can win the battle and the war on our own, that our thoughts must have validity etc.

We can't and they don't.

To think otherwise is to let the enemy win.

Off hand, I'd say the enemy is out to keep you from ever reciting the Jesus Prayer where the Mercy of God is especially implored.

Do the exact opposite of what the enemy's plan is - confound him and beat him into a hasty retreat. You can do it.

This is another rung of the spiritual ladder you are climbing. It is God's way of testing your mettle before He advances you higher up.

At ease, Soldier of Christ! Take the Sword of the Spirit for you must always keep the Name of the Lord Jesus on your lips, in your mind and heart, unceasingly crying: Lord Jesus Christ, Son of God, have mercy on me a sinner!

Alex

Dearest Laura,

You have read alot of good advice. Especially from Fr. Anthony. Enduring lectures can be very taxing on the spirit especially at times like this. So, I will just share my experiance and what it was like for me.

I was once at a point in my journey that I thought "If there is a God he certainly doesn't want anything to do with me." This thought occured to me everytime I looked at the wreckage behind me that was a result of my behavior.

My attitude toward God continued. By His Grace I was able to reach a point of no return. No words can acurately describe the morass of self pity I was trapped in.

I did not believe, however.....I had a willingness to believe. Our blessed Lord talks about a faith the size of a mustard seed. He showed me that my whole life had been centered around wether or not God was on my side. When it seemed that he wasn't I got angry. The point of the matter is that I had to stop playing God and let him be in charge for a while.

I started examining myself and my behaviors with His help. I realized that I had to for the first time in my life get on His side and let him take care of the rest. This small concept revolutionized my whole thinking and my attitude about life. I found that he does love us and he never leaves us behind. I had to suffer for my arrogance to learn that it is united to Christ in His suffering.

I don't want you to feel alone in this. Most people at one time or another go through it. I encourage you to talk to some of the other women in the church about it. I also want you to know that I am here for you. If there is anything I can do please let me know.

In Christ,

Brian J. Biggerstaff
St. Luke's, Sugar Creek, MO

Dear Laura...

I have often found that total honesty is a good thing. I thank you for yours - it was very brave.

Let me join you in your complaints.

I am reminded of the way that Jews often argue with God (Fiddler on the Roof). And I often do that myself. It is as false in a marriage - as it is also in the spiritual life - to pretend that it is always wine and roses and happiness and giggles and deep feelings of swooning - love.

I can think of no quicker way for a marriage to become empty of its humanity - than to try and live it as if it should be the �perfection� of Ward and June - Cleaver (Leave it to Beaver).

I think God WANTS totally honesty from us - and I think we lie to him most of the time. We say � what we think that we should say. Our prayers are mostly formula or approved methods. I think we present a front not only to others people - but to God too. In fact I dare say - mostly - to God.

If any one were to ask me �Ray � do you love God?� � I am afraid I would have to answer �I am not real sure.� at least not in the usual way we think of love.

I have not seen God. I have not had any recent conversations with him face to face. He does not explain himself to me. There is not one thing about today - in which I can say without a doubt �God did this or did that.� I can call my wife on the phone and she says �Hello.� and I can as I love my wife or sons - what help, care, guidance, listening or understanding moments - can I give God??

I have difficult loving other humans - how much harder to love a God? Whom I can not see - hear - touch - etc�??

And I will tell you that I have known God in the past in some real ways. And therefore it seems all the stranger that I (who has �seen� God) and can not doubt his existence nor can I doubt that Jesus is God - how can I then answer to that question� �I am not real sure.�?

I�ll tell you how.

Honesty.

Sometimes I do this: I go to am empty church (try to find one now without locked doors) and once I am real sure no one else is around� I �let him have it!�. Short of actually swearing� I tell God what is on my mind and on my chest. Yep. Less what is on my mind and more what is on my chest. Out loud. Sometimes - real loud. It takes time, it takes emotion, it takes all the items that make us human - for us to dig down deep inside and overturn the rocks to find - what is real - what is honest.

Second best is to go to the woods and do it.

Why? - because � we are so dishonest with ourselves � that I must bring the whole �man� (emotions, instinct, failures, wrongness, etc..) and face God that way. Let the cards fall where they may� but just be real sure I am doing it honestly. Doing this� I can tell you that God is a great � listener.

In doing this � I have found that what God wants above all else from us� is totally honesty. He can work with that� he can not work with our pretenses and our political faces and the many personalities we put on like clothing for the proper occasion. These have been a part of us for so long that we believe � we are they. And there are so many of them - we get confused as to if we are just playing a part (again) or if this is the real �me�. We really don�t know - anymore.

And so Laura � I can tell you that you do not - hate God. If you are really honest with yourself you must see that you really know very little of God (you may be able to be a master at theology - but this is knowing about God - and not an intimate knowledge of God like we have intimate knowledge of a friend of ours - a wife - a husband - our children).

What you hate is that which pretends to be - God (what ever that is).

And only a person who really loves God (wants to be with God because God is all the good we naturally aspire toward) comes to �hate� � what is so much less - than God. Only a person like this can want a God who is - real - and is not satisfied with a God who is not real.

Span the world over � what you will find is divided groups who all - love their - particular - God.

Who should we love?? The God of the Orthodox? The God of the Catholics? (and do not tell me that it is the same God else they would be the same love and love each other above all else). Who shall we love - the God of the Protestants? The God of the Jews? And then within each - because each is also further divided within themselves and can not agree on �God� even within their own church � which of the hundreds of Gods � which the entire world claims is the only true God� which shall we �love�??

Now� since I have made it clear to my own mind that you do not hate God� because knowledge about God is NOT the same as knowledge - of God� I ask myself �What is it that Laura - really - hates?� she really does not know � a that is why she puts it onto God (pin the tail on the donkey). Who else - can we blame for what we do not understand??

Would it irritate you if I were to suggest that maybe - it is God himself - who is inviting you to an inner honesty?

Can you imagine a picture of Heaven - with God listening to us all down hear on earth send up our prayers?? I can see God there listening - bored out of his mind - as he listens in to each and hears so many formula prayers (don�t get me wrong - there is a season for formula prayers)� and with each he hears, time after time, how much we �love� him (we who hardly know what real love is!) and how much we �praise� him (we who really do know him) and how �good� he is� and how much we want to be nearer to him (yet we spurn his daily Providence) and how much we want to be forgiven (just ride us of guilt so we can do the same tomorrow) and yada yada yada� BUT Whoa! What is THIS�?? Is THIS Laura .. Who is saying WHAT IS REALLY on her heart??!! �Peter .. Hold all my calls and put Laura�s line through to my personal office so I can listen with no distractions.�

As always�

I recommend only two books. Both are small.
The Art of Loving � by Erich Fromm
Abandonment to Divine Providence � by Jean Pierre De Cuassade

Now.. About � mercy.

I think that many Christians have the idea that, at some future time - we shall be judged and - deserving nothing � God will extend to us his mercy - for no apparent reasons except - he loves us. And we shall make it - into heaven.

I am not real sure that is a thing to rely on.

If you ask me � the mercy that God will extend to us - is the mercy he has - already - extended to us. He mercy is here and now� and 2000 tears ago. His mercy is - Jesus Christ in person. And so it does not make much sense to me that some ignore working to spiritual repairs - today - in hopes that what they failed to repair about themselves in life - will be repaired by God at no self-cost - at the Pearly gates.

It has also seemed to me that true humility .. Is also true .. Honestly. You can not have one without the other. Humility has also meant to me - and experience of our human limitations. And you have bravely shared with us some of yours.

God desires honesty.
God can only work with what is real.
We can only work with what is real.
God can not work with what is false or pretend.

I say � Have it �out� with God - in total honesty. This also means to watch yourself in what you say because if your try to manipulate God (exaggerations and such like we use when we argue with people) will just waste your time and God�s time. So get down to the real - nuts and bolts. And do not �pretend� God�s part in the conversation (in other words do not feed yourself religious and sentimental tokens).

Just say your say - as honestly as you can determine it - and leave it there. Don�t not pretend to yourself and answer nor that he is advising you through scriptural passages or stock feel good answers.

Take no more than an hour. Say it slowly - blurt it out - don�t monitor your words - just - say it. Say it - and leave it. A few hours later - write just a short summary of what you said to God.

And on the next day - take no more than an hour. Dot it again. Say it - and leave it.
And on the next day - no more than an hour - say it and leave it. And jot down the short note of what you said (nail it down).

Do this every day for seven days (that seems like sufficient time) and I would like to know (now� you really don�t need to tell me but please note it yourself) what was the content of your prayer on the first day - what was the content of your prayer on the third day - and what was the content of your prayer on the seventh (and last) day?? Do not look at any of your notes until you have entirely finished.

And I would like you to tell me of any unusual thing that happens to you during these seven days. Something or anything - way out of the ordinary.

If you do tell me (by private PM if you wish) .. Than .. I will show you something� I will show you and you will see it � for yourself. And if you see it yourself (before and without me) than there is no need to tell me about it.

Are you � game?? Can you see what I am suggesting that you do??

-ray

Just keep enduring! Pray even if you feel you can't or don't want to. After you get out of this spiritual desert you will feel even closer to God then you were before it happened.

I'd suggest reading "Dark Night of the Soul" by St. John of the Cross.

Laura,

As someone who is also struggling, I can tell you this: there is no alternative to Jesus Christ. "Remember me, Oh Lord, when You come into Your Kingdom." So, trust Him.

You are in my prayers.

-- John

Okey-doke Ray, I will PM you when I have done that!

Thanks to all who have posted here or PM'd me; it is really appreciated!

Laura

I understand what you have said. I often think God has an aversion to doing anything the easy way, and makes things as difficult and annoying for us as possible. Sometimes I think he looks down from heaven and says, "Charles, I hate you!" I suspect many people have thoughts like that from time to time. But that is infrequent, since I have many more good days than bad ones. Keep praying and don't give up. I will also offer my prayers for you.