www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall What to do about Judaism

Interesting that *that word* is not allowed on this forum but it is acceptable to refer to a patriarch as the "Patriarch of Terror?"

It does confuse one.

Jennifer,

I have no idea whether you have charity in your heart. My hope is that you do. I am forced to rely on the charity (or lack of it) exhibited in your words.

I don�t remember anyone publicly referring to you as a �troll�, but I only read about 10% of what is posted here. To be fair, however, when you first started posting here back in October many of your posts were very much troll like. They read as if you were bent on arguing with everyone about everything. After awhile you calmed down a little but many of your posts continue to push the envelope of Christian charity.

Can you provide the link to the comment that �Muslim people should �cease to exist�� so I can read it? I need to understand the context before I can comment. On the surface I agree with the comment. I pray daily that everyone � including Muslims � would come to Christ. When this happens Islam will exist no more. That will be a good thing. If forced conversion or other forms of violence were implied in the comment, I would disagree with it and warn the individual not to speak with such uncharity.

Regarding lists, there should be no need for a list of terms that charitable people should refrain from using. A good rule to follow in choosing terms is to ask yourself if you would use the term in the presence of the person you are talking about. In this case, if you were making a presentation to a roomful of Evangelical Christians I highly doubt you would open your presentation with �Good evening, fundygelicals.�

Admin

If you had no idea then why did you publically accuse me of it?

I've just reported a number of posts that are much more uncharitable than the use of "fundygelical." Including describing the latin patriarch of Jerusalem of being the "Patriarch of Terror."

As for the troll comment, that was from Dan (surprise) and was in that unfortunate thread that someone had to delete. Remember where you didn't find it uncharitable to lecture someone about what they should discuss with their confessor? So you see, I'm not convinced that you can truly detect a lack of charity. Either you can't tell it when you see it or you are partisan in your moderation.

John,

I don't believe it is possible to carry on a conversation with Jennifer. So I won't.

I think your observation about the TV commentator is probably accurate. I've heard similar things from both Atheists and from people representing the group for separation of Church and State.

So far the poll is interesting. I'll comment on the findings in a few days.

Dan L

Jennifer,

Nothing I wrote addresses the charity in your heart. I clearly spoke to what you wrote. I addressed what you wrote and what people write is what I must use to judge their charity (or lack thereof). I cannot know what is in your heart.

Regarding the thread you have reported, no one on the Forum has accused the Latin Patriarch of Jerusalem of being the �Patriarch of Terror�. The thread is named after the title of a magazine article and the discussion is of the contents of that article. Surely you are not expecting me to enforce the rule of Christian charity upon the whole world? Or to forbid discussions of public figures and their behavior?

Yes, I now remember the thread in which I suggested to several people that they discuss the issue with their spiritual director. I stand by that advice. It is always appropriate to suggest to someone to rethink an issue together with their spiritual director. I still don�t understand your grounds in rejecting that suggestion, since it is a common enough suggestion within the Church.

You might be correct in your comments on my moderation. I may be the worst moderator / administrator in the whole world. People come and go on forums like this. The Forum seems to have attracted a genuinely nice group of people who are willing to tolerate my mistakes and general unfairness towards them. I hope that you can tolerate me, too, and that you can modify your style of posting so that it reflects charity at all times.

Admin

Wrong. The exact quote was "For you to say this means you do not have charity in your heart."

The problem with your moderation is that you allow bad behavior from certain behavior. You jumped all over Iconophile in that thread but said nothing to Dan. Here you jump all over me but again say nothing to Dan. His posts are really terrible and hurtful but he's never chastised. The only logical interpretation to lack of fair moderation is that you choose only to moderate those who disagree with you about politics.

Of course you could prove me wrong by fairly moderating this board.

John,

You are doing a fine job. I don't understand why Jennifer wants to fight over everything. I won't venture a guess, but keep up the good work. Perhaps she is like so many people I've met over the years. She may think she must try to intimidate her way through life.

BTW I especially liked the insert for today's liturgy. Thanks again for your work.

Dan L

Only after they close the books on the food-for-oil program in Iraq? Sure.

SPDundas,

"Hannukah."

Fascinating idea. To the Jews this is a minor holiday. Yet, I don't see why we wouldn't celebrate it. Though it might appear to the Jews as if we were coopting something beautiful that belongs only to them.

Dan L

Dear Professor Dan,

Actually, as you know, the feast of the Holy Maccabean Martyrs is popular in our Church, celebrated on the Administrator's birthday, August 1st (14th, Old Calendar).

On that day, because the word "Mak" in "Maccabee" means "Poppyseed" in the Slavic languages, poppyseeds are blessed for use in the "Kutya" for Christmas Eve Holy Supper.

So the cult of the Maccabees is strong in our Church and I, for one, see no reason why we shouldn't celebrate Chanukah.

The more we know about Judaism and the Jewish background of our own faith, the better Christians we become, or so I think!

Shalom!

Alex

This is just my opinion, but I think we have a confused idea of what constitutes charity these days. I am afraid the concept of charity has become mixed with political correctness, in that we must never say anything that offends someone. I won't go into the fact that many folks have made a career out of being offended to gain the moral high-ground for advancing their own interests. I believe that the idea that offending someone is some great sin is absolute nonsense. Charity has a basis in truth which will always offend someone, somewhere. Even Christ said that the world would hate us, because it hated Him before it hated us. Anyone who upholds Christ's truth will be accused of being uncharitable by those who don't accept that truth. Of course that doesn't mean any of us can be mean-spirited. But true charity does not hide reality and honesty to spare someone's feelings. The way I read scripture, I could be judged for not speaking truth if what I say leads someone astray.

Dear Charles,

Could we also be judged for leading people astray by trying them to receive the truth before they are ready for it?

Alex

I think the notion of 'charity' that is advanced here is rather bizarre. Certain words are forbidden but debates entitled "what to do about Judaism" are allowed. Mean spirited remarks are allowed as long as they are made by certain posters.

I've heard from several people who neither post nor visit here anymore because of the way this forum is moderated. IMHO that's not charity. Terms that the Administrator deems "hateful" are not allowed but people leave this forum and get turned off on Byzantine Catholicism in general because of the bullying behavior that is allowed here.

That's a bizarre form of charity. One that I am not familiar with.

There is nothing "to be done" about Judaism. Rather, we as Catholics and Orthodox should learn more about our Judaic heritage from our Jewish brothers and sisters. Conversion comes from the heart not from proselytizing.

The question "what to do about Judaism" implies that we can do something about Judaism and further want to do something about Judaism. I find both to be highly offensive in light of Christianity's historical encounters with Judaism.