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http://www.mospat.ru/index.php?page=28504

Ukrainian President decorates Metropolitan Vladimir of Kiev and All Ukraine with the Order of Yaroslav the Wise

Ukrainian President V.Yuschenko decorated the primate of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church Metropolitan Vladimir of Kiev and All Ukraine with the Order of Yaroslav the Wise, 2nd class.


The decree issued by the head of the Ukrainian state on 23 November 2005 reads that the primate of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church is awarded for his church, charitable work and on the occasion of his 70th birthday.


�Ukrainian News�
Information Agency

Congratulations to Metropolitan Volodymyr of Kyiv.

But...
For those who don't follow news in Ukraine closely, these awards are a dime a dozen. I wouldn't read much into this. :rolleyes:

One thing that does drive me up the wall is when clergy wear their various secular awards. In his defense, I have never seen Metropolitan Volodymyr wearing one. (This is not his first award.)

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

Of course, but they are ever so delivered...Being an act of state, it stands to reason that the Ukrainian state recognizes the legitimacy of +Metropolitan Vladimir of Kiev (along with the rest of the Orthodox world). An interesting sign!

Let's look the trophy cabinets of both Metropolitan Volodymyr and Patriarch Filaret. I won't list Soviet era awards (both have received them), not awards from canonical Churches (both have received these).

Metropolitan Volodymyr
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class V (2000)
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class IV (2001)
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class III (2002)
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class II (2005)
Source [orthodox.org.ua]


Patriarch Filaret
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class V (1999)
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class IV (2001)
Order of Yaroslav the Wise, class III (2004)
Source [kievpatriarh.org.ua]

Expect Patriarch Filaret to receive the above order, class II, some time in 2006.

I'm still looking for an official list of all the various other religious leader in Ukraine who have received awards from the State. So much for such awards being a sign of some sort of canonical "legitimacy". :p

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

But they do show recognition...Unlike Mr. Denisenko, +Metropolitan Vladimir has not been deposed for having a common law wife; moreover, he has been recognized by the Orthodox Church as the CANONICAL Metropolitan of Kiev...Last I checked Rome DEFINITELY was not entertaining recognizing the deposed and quite married (at least common law) Mr. Denisenko either...

Dear kollyvas,

Don't mix apples and oranges. You posted this news as "proof" of the legitimacy of the UOC-MP. No one (at least here) has denied that the UOC-MP is the representative of canonical Orthodoxy in Ukraine. (Please note that in the eyes of "World Orthodoxy" there is no "Ukrainian Orthodox Church" as Moscow's grant of "autonomy" is only for matters internal [there is no canonical provision for this, btw], id est, the UOC-MP is an internal structure of the Russian Orthodox Church.)

As for Patriarch Filaret being deposed for having a wife, what took Moscow so long? He was even a serious contender for the patriarchal throne of Moscow. Seems to me the MP wasn't too bothered by Filaret's "history" until there was a growing movement for autocephaly in Kyiv. I hate to burst your bubble, but there are a lot of bishops in that part of the world with skeletons in their closets. As long as everyone plays along, no one raises a fuss.

And what does Rome have to do with any of this? The Catholic Church, in general, does not comment much on the goings on in the Orthodox world. It has no justification for doing so. OTOH, certain Orthodox Churches are quite fond of telling the Catholic Church what it should and shouldn't do.

I have not found an official list of recipients of the Order of Yaroslav the Wise on the web, but if one searches for "Орден князя Ярослава Мудрого" one will find quite a number of reports of recipients: Fidel Castro, the Armenian Patriarch, Lech Walensa, etc.

To summarise: Metropolitan Volodymyr has received an award which 1) is handed out like candy; 2) has also been award to Patriarch Filaret. It is a nice award, but doesn't mean nearly as much as you think it does.

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

Of course divorced from context, as you would like, it means "nothing." But your own presentation states otherwise. By your own admission: 1). +Metropolitan Philaret is the canonical and recognized primate of the Orthodox Church in the Ukrainian state. 2). The medal was handed out by the Ukrainian state in recognition of his status. 3). Mr. Denisenko is indeed deposed. 4). Rome, NO ONE recognizes Mr. Denisenko. So his receiving the same award has a different significance along the lines of Walensa or Castro receiving it, especially in light of recent pronouncements on who indeed leads the Ukrainian church on the part of the world. Your initial attempt at putting forward some sort of equivalence falls to pieces...Great summary.

I seem to be reading something that does not have the same text as what you are reading.

It has never been implied about the canonicity of any of the recipients. Neither has the implication that the award has been ever been given other than a recognition for whatever reasons from the Ukranian Republic. Last, I never saw any reference into who recognizes as canonical in the Orthodox world or not.

In commenting, please try to keep within the context of what the poster is saying, and not trying to read into it.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Moderator

Oh... NOW I understand you, kollyvas. The significance of the award depends on who is receiving it. I can't argue with logic like that! :rolleyes:

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

Yeah, like weighing the award of the Nobel peace prize to someone like yassir arafat or jimmy carter vs someone like Boris Pasternak...But then again if it ain't morally equivalent (not serving a silly agenda), it ain't right or doesn't matter, right?! BTW, "Kobzar" was originally written in Literary Russian and has as yet to be "updated." I was referencing an earlier post where leaders of the Orthodox world, including the ep have recognized +Metropolitan Vladimir. I thought Kobzar indicated +Vladimir was the canonical head of the Ukrainian church. Moreover, Mr. Denisenko could never be, for he was deposed by his synodeia before pretending to a patriarchal title...

Let's see...
Nobel Peace Prize: Yasser Arafat - 1994 [nobelprize.org] , Jimmy Carter - 2002 [nobelprize.org] .
Nobel Prize in Literature: Boris Pasternak - 1958 [nobelprize.org] .
I am confused... Does Pasternak's Nobel Prize mean more because it was for literature, or because he was Russian?

This is completely irrelevant to the thread. Or have we gone Pasternak -> Nobel Prize for Literature -> Literature -> Shevchenko -> his "Kobzar"? Plausible logic, but pointless to the discussion at hand. And for your information, my screen name has nothing to do with that work. If you wanted to take a swipe at me you'll have to try harder. :p If you wish to discuss literature, I suggest you start a thread in Town Hall .

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

P.S.

I note kollyvas has edited his post since I started my reply. I have quoted his original version.

First off, it has to do with the merit of the award: Dr. Zhivago was an indictment of the horrors of the revolution and a testament to the triumph of the human condition. It inspired and made people aware of a great evil of our time. This was in distinction to political awards which simply were meant as "statements" against this or that policy European leftists didn't care for. After all, Jimmy Carter was the most inept president in the history of the USA whose policies led to islamist iran and communist expansion. arafat died a bloodthirsty terrorist. Not paragons of the cause of peace?!Now, the Kobzar point was introduced "incidentally," that means as an aside, since you make a point of it in your avatar. I edited out that last comment, for I didn't want to venture into the whole lewis carol reality discussion which normally ensues with ukrainoznavstvo, but, yes, it is an accurate statement of my thought and the whole morphism the Ukrainian language has undergone in the last 100 years...

Kollyvas,

The complaints are starting to come in.

Anti-"anything" bias will not be tolerated on this forum in any section. Your last post is perceived as such. If you can not abide by this rule which has been addressed in other threads, the matter will be referred to the admin for action.

Father Anthony+
Moderator

I look forward to the day you join the Nobel Foundation and make sure only truly qualified people receive these awards, not the buffons they have let slip through all these years. :rolleyes:

Thank you for taking the time to explain the meaning of the word "incidentaly" to me, but I am fairly fluent in English (both US and UK varieties), as well as other langauges.

If you wish to avoid the whole "ukrainoznavstvo" then let me suggest this: don't bring it up.

Oυτις ημιν φιλει ου φροντιδα | Nemo Nos Diliget Non Curamus

WOW...I guess you won't be winning the Nobel Prize in anything if you think only that evil Ukrainian language has "morphed".

Gaudior, who can't believe the hate against Ukraine coming through in this thread which has nothing to do with Byzantine Catholicism