www.byzcath.org Forums Mysteries: The Life of Worship Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy The Revised Divine Liturgy New Music

I understand the multiple issues with the new recasted Divine Liturgy. Yet, I'm struggling to get a handle on the whole new music issue that seems to incite folks so much.

Can someone please help me understand the music issues.

In Christ,

John

John,

Here is the question that the Revisionists need to answer:

What need is there to change the settings for the fixed parts of the Divine Liturgy in English that are in common use in 100% of our parishes?

Anyone who compares the IELMC / MCI music at the start of this thread to what we are currently using will see that it is awful. Why should we change?

Don�t hold your breath waiting for an answer.

My pastor is predicting a major fight in our church if Archbishop Basil ever promulgates the Revised Liturgy. When it happens remember it was brought to us by the Revisionists.

Java Joe

"What need is there to change the settings for the fixed parts of the Divine Liturgy in English that are in common use in 100% of our parishes?"

If we want to be truer to the Slavonic originals they need to be changed. The music we have been using for 40 years is dumbed down. It is the desire of the Hierarchs to make the settings truer to their Slavonic originals. One may disagree with the necessity of being truer to the Slavonic, however.

Fr. Deacon Lance

Could you please provide specific examples of how it is awful?

We need to break through this impasse regarding quesions and vague or no answers. No one on either side seems to be addressing any questions and they are being constantly repeated with the same response, nothing. If one considers something to be "awful" then please tell the forum why. If it is a matter of personal taste, state so. If you find it difficult to sing, or there is a problem with the translation, state it. Nothing can be done without some clarifiaction. Sounds reasons need to be addressed here, but can not without specifics.

I am going to ask Pro and Anti Revision posters to be specific in their points. You may think that only a few are reading these posts, but in fact many are viewing this and trying to decide where they stand on the issue that is affecting their faith.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Administrator

I wish we could hear side-by-side sound files to compare the versions.

How is the new music awful in comparison? I too would like concrete examples, cause frankly I'm just dazzled by the fact that there's a church book with musical notation now, so that way it's easier to follow along!

By the way, the argument that something is widely used is no excuse, the liberal Romans tried to use that against the new translation of their liturgy. It's a poor excuse. Naziism was prevalent once in Germany, does that mean we shouldn't have abolished it? Not meaning to make what was there (musically wise) sound that bad or anything, but I got my point across I believe.

Java Joe,

You asked Jeff for an explanation of his side. We await yours. This is far above and beyond what I have the time and patience to do! See this thread:
https://www.byzcath.org/bboard/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=000082

John S.,

So far, this is getting close to side by side sound files. It's side by side music! It's only one comaprison of the music , but it's a start.


Steve

I think Mr. Jerry Jumba's setting is more authentic to the Slavonic Prostopinije and is much more singable.

Ungcsertezs

He has certainly done some good settings over the years, Keith, and I hope someday he will allow me to typeset some of them and add them to the music on the MCI website.

Yours in Christ,
Jeff

Too bad his work has been shunned by the Liturgical Commission. Many years of compilation and translation of Rusyn Prostopinije going to waste. It's a real shame his work has been pushed aside by the Ruthenian Archeparchy.

ungcsertezs

I just checked out the music on the website Steve provided. As a cantor, I can say that the new music is definitely singable and I don't think my parish would have any problem getting used to the new melody. If the cantors learn the music and practice at home before church so that they can lead confidently, the congregation will follow.

Of prime importance is how to implement. To have the cantors learn all the new music over a period of a few months, and then switch everything when a book with the new words and notation appears in the pew probably would be disastrous. Too many parishioners, if they read music at all, cannot sight-read to sing. They learn by listening and then singing along quietly (although a few are not so quiet and seem to have their own ideas of what the notes should be :rolleyes: ). A better idea might be to implement just one or two portions of the new music in a single tone each month, repeating them for 4 or 5 or even 6 weeks, if necessary. It would take longer for full implementation, but it wouldn't overwhelm the congregation and send them into open revolt.

It would be nice to have lessons with the congregation outside liturgy, but we can't even seem to get all the cantors together for a rehearsal before Pascha.

As for a CD already having been recorded, my hope is that it will be not with a full choir but with a single voice. I would like to concentrate on getting it right rather than on how I can't compare to the choir. Also, it should be indexed for each piece of liturgy, rather than by tone so that we can play the same piece over and over until we master it.

Sophia

Right now at my parish we only have printed music for changeable propers for Liturgy, unless a special printing takes place, but most know all other regular music by heart. I figure Sophia's idea is best, to introduce music from the book gradually. A selection could be announced prior to the service, and/or be mentioned in the Sunday bulletin, with a reference to the page in the book. Of course, it is also possible that most of what we already do is in the book, and won't require change.