www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Very Interesting Statements

If we are Roman Catholics because a Roman picked our bishops, then all of us are historically in trouble. When the King of Poland or the Duke of Lithunia or the Sultan of Turkey picked Orthodox bishops, were they Polish Orthodox, Lithuanian Orthodox, Turkish Orthodox?

We Ruthenians used to have a Unitarian Count pick our bishop. forced to choose, I'll take the status quo!!!

K.

To Orthodox Catholic:

Alex, I certainly hope nothing tragic happens regarding your ecclesial affiliation. However, if it did, there is a place where you can still be a "Ritual" minority within an apostolic church, still view yourself as an Orthodox Catholic on several levels, and where you can indulge any Anglophyllic tendencies as much as you like. We would be more than happy to have you at St. Peter's in Fort Worth. Maybe TCU has an opening?

David Lewis

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Thank you Anthony for saying that. I agreed, but with the hostility being shown towards the good cardinal by both Orhtodox and Byzantine Catholics, I felt weary to do so. I was thinking to myself, "I hope Anthony reads this, this needs a moderators touch"

IC XC NIKA,
-Nik!

[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: Administrator ]

Bob, why are you telling us this? Is this supposed to be news to us? Oh, I forgot we (Byzantine Rite Roman Catholics) are *Western* Christians. :rolleyes:


Ummm, for the record, GOD is my final authority.

OrthoMan,

Currently Latin Catholics carry the Gospel book held above the head and kiss it also. This was not done when I was a child but it is an old tradition, as I understand it, brung back.

I don't share your view regarding the Pope and the Koran. And personaly I prefer healthy soil to the Bible, the Koran, or any other proclaimed "holy book". It's areas like these that I think I may prefer Buddhist thought over superstious Christian propaganda. I can't speak for the Byzantines - and perhaps not for every single Latin - but I'm confident a few men would follow me when I say: we have our Bible he's our Pope.

A few indeed but a few of our more robust men

Dear OrthoMan,

If the Pope kisses the Quran for the truths it contains (as he defines truth for himself; namely, as Christian truth), then it follows that he's not venerating the "truths" in it that deny Christianity, for those are in actuality false.

But to say what you said above (without clarifying that those "truths" are just that..."truths" in name but not in substance) strikes me as an implicit recognition of the truth of the Quran, which you and I know is wrong. Perhaps you worded it wrong, or perhaps I'm reading it wrong...it just doesn't seem totally accurate to me.

[Perhaps you worded it wrong, or perhaps I'm reading it wrong...it just doesn't seem totally accurate to me.]

No, you are right. I worded it wrong. What I meant to imply is that by kissing it he is proclaiming it contents contain the true word of God. Hows that?

OrthoMan

I would think the meaning of the action is the meaning the actor intendes to give to it.

[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: Kurt ]

I trust you are not calling the Koran truth? I see it as closer to dirt than to truth.

Quote

For a Byzantine Catholic to deny they are Roman Catholic and then in the next sentence to complain about how long it is taking for THE POPE IN ROME to pick or approve their new Hierach is laughable to us.

Sometimes, it can be laughable from this POV as well. Usually, when someone asks "are you a Roman Catholic?", I answer, "No, I'm WORSE than that!!!"

They may stop the questions, afraid of being dragged into a cult or something.

Or, I will have an opportunity to witness our Church history and how we got to here and now.


Definitely not Protestant,
Not quite Roman Catholic,
Unacceptable to the Orthodox,
Necessarily a Uniate Ukie,
Outlawed and Harassed,
But by the Grace of God and
The prayers of Pious People,
Still Here.

Amen!


May God Bless You Now and Forever

John
Pilgrim and Odd Duck

This statement actually speaks very highly of Roman and Byzantine Catholics and, at the same time, very poorly of the Orthodox.

Regarding the pope kissing the Koran, it is a far stretch to claim that kissing it is necessary acceptance that it contains truth. Kissing it should be taken as a gesture of respect to the Islamic people since they are made in the image of Christ, as are all humans. I personally do not think that it was a wise thing to do. But I was not there and do not know how I would react if I was visiting an Islamic house of worship and the Koran was suddenly placed before me. Maybe the only respectful thing for the Holy Father to do was to show his respect for the people Islam by kissing their holy book? Could he have refused to kiss the Koran and yet managed to be respectful? If he did later conclude that this gesture was unwise is there no forgiveness for him? If I saw a Koran lying in the street I would carefully take it and return to the local Islamic community out of respect and out of the hope that they would do the same if they found a Bible lying in the street.

Hi,

Its seems the more things change the more they remain the same. Who's responsibility is it for the split a 1000 years ago? Hierarchs. Who made this statement? A hierarch.We have given the Hierarchs a 1000 years to straighten this mess out.Maybe the laity should say we aren't asking you ,we are telling you we want re-unification. Since the laity are no longer ignorant peasants perhaps a grass roots effort from the Parishes up will get this straightened out. It doesn't seem to be working from the top down. If we can put a man on the moon....and if the Baba's had their say this would have been taken care of a long time ago.

Nicky's Baba

Nicky's Baba,

Your words are so true!

Who didn't want married priests in this country? Hierarchs. Who mandated clerical celibacy? A hierarch. Who obeyed it and caused a rift in his own church? A hierarch. Who left and began his own church under Constantinople? A future hierarch. Who in Constantinople accepted this future hierarch? A hierarch. Who are ultimately in charge of ecumenical discussions? Hierarchs.

While the population of the Eastern Catholics have gone down by half over the past quarter century, what number has gone up inversely proportional to that population? The number of hierarchs!

The icon of the Divine Ladder, where hierarchs and monks are seen falling, tells all. The author of that one had a sense of humor, but was only being truthful for telling it like it is.

I know not one "Baba" who destroyed, alienated, split, messed up, taught heresy, was condemned for heresy, accused of pedophilia, or confiscated a church or an entire region of churches. There should be more "Babas" on our liturgical calendar.

Isaiah is probably in Heaven grinding his prophetic teeth.

[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: J Thur ]

Joe,

Excellent point. Let us hope and pray that some of the new hierarchs who will be taking the reigns soon will undo this terrible wound.

Anthony

Anthony,

We shall see. Something is gonna have to be done so our current priests can retire from active ministry at least before they hit their 90th birthday.

Joe

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Amen to you Nicky's Baba & Joe. Amen, Amen Amen!

IC XC NIKA,
-Nik!

[ 03-12-2002: Message edited by: Administrator ]