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Here is an article about some of the challenges that Pope Benedict will face during his trip to Brazil, which starts today.

-- John




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In Brazil pope to face a church losing hold
priest shortage, evangelicals represent challenges
by Monte Reel
The Washington Post
Updated: 4:02 a.m. ET May 9, 2007
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/18561687/


SAO PAULO, May 8 - When Pope Benedict XVI lands here Wednesday for his first visit to Latin America since becoming pontiff, he will set foot in a region considered by many here to be the heart of his church, home to nearly half the world's Roman Catholics.

A clear challenge awaits him: to persuade them to stay true to a church that is losing thousands of adherents throughout the region every day.

Latin America is still predominantly Catholic, but not like it used to be. In Brazil, for example, as evangelical Pentecostalism has spread, the country's population has gone from being 89 percent Catholic in 1980 to about 64 percent today, according to a survey released this week by the Brazilian polling firm DataFolha.

Similar shifts are happening throughout the region, from Mexico to Chile. Young people have shown a greater reluctance to join the clergy, resulting in a priest shortage that is 10 times more severe regionwide than it is in North America or Europe. Many congregations have tried to retain members by relaxing the formality of Masses and infusing services with more emotion, fueling a "charismatic movement" that is now practiced by roughly half of Brazilian Catholics, according to a 2006 study by the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life.

"There is a trend here -- even among priests -- that people should be more free to follow their own conscience, and there's a growing distance between most Catholics and the church's hierarchy," said the Rev. Luiz Roberto Benedetti, a Catholic priest who is a professor of social science at the Catholic University of Campinas, near Sao Paulo. "It's a trend that goes in the complete opposite direction of the message that the pope wants to send."

Benedict's five-day visit to Brazil will give him the chance to deliver his message to huge crowds in what remains the largest Catholic nation in the world. On Thursday evening, the 80-year-old pope is expected to fill a soccer stadium during a youth rally. As many as 1 million people are expected to attend his open-air Mass on Friday morning at an airfield in Sao Paulo. On Sunday he will preside over a second public Mass in Aparecida, west of Rio de Janeiro, where he will also open a conference of Latin American bishops.

�The proselytism of sects�

In a letter to those bishops in February, Benedict wrote that the rise of the evangelical churches -- he calls them "sects" -- is something they must work together to understand: The church, he wrote, "must deal with the proselytism of sects and the growing influence of post-modern hedonistic secularism. If we are to find the right answers, we must think seriously about what makes the sects attractive."

Many Catholics in Latin America have been anxiously awaiting this trip, Benedict's first to the Western Hemisphere. During his first two years heading the Vatican, his speeches and writings have extolled the basics of the faith, emphasizing charity and compassion. But he retains a reputation as a rigorous theologian: To him, the idea of bending the religion to the times is philosophically inconsistent with the eternal truths he believes the church is built upon.

In Latin America, where grinding poverty and violence are defining qualities of life in many places, some are looking for direct responses from Benedict to contemporary problems. David Gibson, author of the 2006 biography "The Rule of Benedict," said the pope believes that spiritual poverty must be addressed before material poverty -- a principle that might satisfy theoretical needs, he said, if not practical ones.

"The problem is that there are all these issues -- real, hard, concrete issues -- that demand practical solutions in Latin America, and he's going to come essentially with his message of simple, basic faith," Gibson said. "You can't argue with that, but the question is: 'Is it enough?' "

The Catholic Church throughout Latin America has grappled with that question for decades. In the 1960s, a school of thought called liberation theology emerged in Peru and took hold throughout the region, depicting Jesus as a revolutionary figure and encouraging Catholics to fight against governments that the movement's followers believed hurt the poor.

In the 1980s, Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger -- now Benedict -- led the Vatican's campaign to wipe out the movement, which he said replaced the church's spiritual role with misplaced socioeconomic activism. As pope, he has continued to stress a traditional approach: In October, he approved a denunciation of the Rev. Jon Sobrino, a proponent of liberation theology in El Salvador.

The evangelical Christian churches, meanwhile, have appealed directly to the urban poor and have grown rapidly. Catholics have since taken some cues from the evangelicals, giving rise to the charismatic movement that is particularly popular in Brazil. Bishops who once denounced the idea of up-tempo Masses now support them, and traditionally conservative Catholic churches have altered their Masses to give them a more contemporary flavor. Some Catholic Masses are delivered in large, warehouse-style buildings filled to capacity with dancing crowds singing boisterous gospel music.

"For me, the more charismatic, the better," said Walter Duarte, 36, a carpenter who attended Mass last Sunday at one of the more traditional Catholic churches in Sao Paulo. "I myself am an example of someone who was drawn to the church by the charismatic movement. I was attracted by the music."

The nontraditional approach runs counter to the image most people have of Benedict, who is expected to issue a decree making it easier for churches to conduct traditional Latin Masses. But Zelinda Britto, 52, said she believes the pope will look kindly on Latin America's style of Catholicism when he visits and will recognize that it has helped the church retain young members.

�He�s not just about sin and guilt�

"It's about joy," said Britto, before ducking into a church service. "The music gives me the sensation that God is closer. I believe God wants us to feel that sort of happiness and joy. God is meant to be worshiped -- He's not just about sin and guilt."

The Catholic Church's outlook in Brazil is not so gloomy either, according to some clergy.

"There are lots of movements that are always happening within the church here, and that is not a bad thing," said Dom Orani Joao Tempesta, archbishop of Belem, Brazil. "They are all trying to bring people to the faith, so they all have their value."

The recent survey that tracked the declining numbers of Catholics here also revealed some more-promising data for church leaders: 97 percent of Brazilians believe in God, 93 percent believe Christ rose from the dead, and 86 percent believe in the virgin birth. To Tempesta, that means the Catholic Church's 500-year presence in Latin America has laid a foundation that it is well-positioned to build upon.

"I hope the pope's visit enlightens people throughout Latin America about how to best to be a Catholic in a place that is living with the consequences of globalization and poverty," said Tempesta, who will attend the bishops conference this weekend. "And I hope we can show him that we still have hope, confidence and joy, too, despite whatever problems there might be."



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In a letter to those bishops in February, [Pope] Benedict wrote that the rise of the evangelical churches -- he calls them "sects" -- is something they must work together to understand: The church, he wrote, "must deal with the proselytism of sects and the growing influence of post-modern hedonistic secularism. If we are to find the right answers, we must think seriously about what makes the sects attractive."


This, in my opinion, is the issue in a nutshell.

-- John

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The evangelical Christian churches, meanwhile, have appealed directly to the urban poor and have grown rapidly. Catholics have since taken some cues from the evangelicals, giving rise to the charismatic movement that is particularly popular in Brazil. Bishops who once denounced the idea of up-tempo Masses

Excuse me while I go look for a barf bag!!

now support them, and traditionally conservative Catholic churches have altered their Masses to give them a more contemporary flavor. Some Catholic Masses are delivered in large, warehouse-style buildings filled to capacity with dancing crowds singing boisterous gospel music.

And the difference between this and a nightclub is......?

"For me, the more charismatic, the better," said Walter Duarte, 36, a carpenter who attended Mass last Sunday at one of the more traditional Catholic churches in Sao Paulo. "I myself am an example of someone who was drawn to the church by the charismatic movement. I was attracted by the music."

You are supposed to come to Church because of Truth, not because the service makes yer flesh twitch and yer feet boogey!!

I know there are going to be at least a half a dozen people lined up to tell me that I my post is "unloving, uncharitable, judgmental, etc. etc. etc. Okay. Suppose you prove to me that the Early Fathers would have compromised with the world like this even one iota to draw in crowds or to bring back fallen away believers!

This is why I didn't get all that exited about the Holy Father's pronouncements regarding pro-death politicians. There is just too much that is slipping under the wire now for me to take that seriously. He pontificates about the dangers of neo-modernism and allows this garbage to go on unobstructed.

We'll see if he bans a few dozen of these lewd excuses for Mass and then I'll get on the bandwagon. Until then

I'm waiting............

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Hmmm Frankly Altar Boy your post sounds like you want to make traditional europeans out of everyone.

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one simple point. compare the Catholic church to the time before the Vatican II council and after. there is no comparison.

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another point...how can Latin American continue being Latin America without the Roman Catholic Church? take the Latin rite out of the picture and i guess it's possible.

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Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, welcome Pope Benedict XVI!

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Originally Posted by RomanRedneck
Hmmm Frankly Altar Boy your post sounds like you want to make traditional europeans out of everyone.

First of all, it IS called the TRADITIONAL ROMAN MASS, is it not? If they are going to be part of the Roman praxis, then they should do a real Mass and not some nightclub act.

If they don't want that, we have a lovely choice of other rites such as Maronite, Melkite, Reuthenian, Coptic, etc. from which to choose. I'm sure these would be no more out of place in Brazil than they are in America, which is traditionally English/Irish in its past.

You DO understand the purpose of the Mass as defined by the Holy Scriptures, don't you? What they are doing in Brazil doesn't come anywhere close.

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I think Evangelicals are so successful because they build strong faith communities. There are always Bible study classes before worship and everyone sings/participates in the worship service - they don't go to church to 'fulfill their duty'. Also, there are often activities at the churches throughout the week like: Wednesdays evening services, Vacation Bible School, potluck dinners, etc. They are also there for each other in emergencies, like if a member is sick and the family needs meals brought to the house.
Joining an Evangelical church is often a life-altering decision. 'I was "of the world" yesterday, but came to know/accept Christ and was baptized. Now I live for Christ and follow the New Testament pattern for living, along with other fervent followers of Christ' - a community has been formed of like-minded individuals.
Unfortunately, many Catholics look for the parish with the quickest Mass, so they can 'fulfill their duty'. Roman Catholics have the worst sense of community of any Christians I know of. I'm not criticizing Catholic teaching, just the lack of community.
Human Beings are social creatures and crave community, which is sadly lacking in the modern world!

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Originally Posted by Altar Boy
Originally Posted by RomanRedneck
Hmmm Frankly Altar Boy your post sounds like you want to make traditional europeans out of everyone.

First of all, it IS called the TRADITIONAL ROMAN MASS, is it not? If they are going to be part of the Roman praxis, then they should do a real Mass and not some nightclub act.

If they don't want that, we have a lovely choice of other rites such as Maronite, Melkite, Reuthenian, Coptic, etc. from which to choose. I'm sure these would be no more out of place in Brazil than they are in America, which is traditionally English/Irish in its past.

You DO understand the purpose of the Mass as defined by the Holy Scriptures, don't you? What they are doing in Brazil doesn't come anywhere close.

Brother Ed


Ok, since you have obviously wittnessed these masses first hand, perhaps you can tell us what goes on that is unorthodox. Is that too much to ask?

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I agree with you on the lack of community in Catholic churches. I think one of the reason we lose people to the evangelicals is social, not doctrinal. That's something I don't understand, because it seems to me that the church was a social component of everyday life in earlier times.

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Quote
Ok, since you have obviously wittnessed these masses first hand, perhaps you can tell us what goes on that is unorthodox. Is that too much to ask?

Excuse me?

You didn't read the article linked in the first post? You didn't read my quote?

They are running what basically amounts to a nightclub. If I want to mill around in a large warehouse, singing songs, dancing, and acting goofy, I can go to downtown Harrisburg and find any number of such establishments which have been thrown up in old empty warehouses.

Hebrews 8:5 and 9: 23 - 24 show us what worship is supposed to be. Beginning with Moses, worship was established by God to be a "shadow and type" of the heavenly reality. It is a witness to unseen truth and unseen worship. That is why everything about the Mass (Liturgy) is so important, right down to the smallest details.

Of course, the Roman Church is busy as they can be destroying this witness of typology, beginning with the removal of the altar rails, which is a very theologically important piece of achitectual destruction. In the East we have maintained this important distinctive (except in those parishes which accepted Latinizations in the last century).

Not only the altar rails, but buildings that are monstrosities, looking more like office buildings rather than places of worship with the proper decor.

Do you have ANY idea why communion in the hand is theologically WRONG? I doubt it. Romans have been gradually brain numbed, year after year, to accept the subtle changes that the enemies of the Church have snuck in, and have accepted these things without a peep of resistance.

God feeds me. I do not feed myself. God ALONE gives me eternal life. The only participation I have in this is to open my mouth and recieve. This typfies how grace comes to us. God alone is the prime mover -- as stated concisely in the canons of the Council of Orange. Communion in the hand typifies that I -- a sinner who would turn on God in a heartbeat if left to myself -- am capable of spiritually feeding myself, a perogative which belongs to the God alone.

Thumpin' music, nightclub atmosphere, irreverent dress (I would bet my HOUSE on this one, even though I haven't seen it, it goes with the overall structure)

This is NOT worship. This is tickling the flesh. We are supposed to be "living sacrifices" The life of the Christian is supposed to be a divorce from the world. It is supposed to entail our dying to the world and worldly worship.

This is aiding and abettting the enemy.

Brother Ed

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the reason so many Latin Americans are becomming protestants is primarily, poor catechesis throughout its history.throw in that the church made the mass more appealing to protestants to win their hearts to conversion in return its catholics instead. the ones who now cant tell the difference between catholic worship and the protestant brand. its sad. the hierarchy is afraid re-introducing traditional practices back into the mass out of fear of losing more catholics, but what they do not realise is that its the only way to stop the bleeding. the priesthood especially is in danger.

the mass has been reduced to a show. the only solution is to put the tabernacle back on the altar, in the center and make the priest turn around and face God, leading the people. communion in the hand is very dangerous. the only one who sees this is the Pope.

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Brother Ed,

I want to make it clear that it is not my intention to make you angrier than you already are. You came into this thread with guns ablazing shooting at MY Pope and MY Church and I took offense. If things are great in the East and things are done like they are supposed to be done then dont worry about how we do things in the west, just be glad you've got a church that does it right. (I am not being sarcastic here). I'll be the first to admit we RC's have a long way to go before we are back up to snuff but taking pot shots from easterners isnt gonna do anything but make things worse. People will be angered, offended and hurt and alienated from the East even more than they already are. All I am asking from you is to choose your words carefully and without anger and biting sarcasm.

Your brother in Christ

Jason

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Decades of liberation theology, along with attempts to make the church adapt to the so called "Modern World" have only helped to greatly reduce the Catholic Church's numbers in Brazil. Those inovations aren't bringing in new Catholics, instead they're turning old ones into Evangelical Protestants. Brazil needs more churchmen like Cardinal Jaime de Barros Camara.

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