|
0 members (),
698
guests, and
65
robots. |
|
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
|
Forums26
Topics35,506
Posts417,456
Members6,150
| |
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 59
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 59 |
I am reposting my original posts that have disappeared down the chain. I have learned that people are writing to Rome and that Rome is listening to the faithful priests and people of the Ruthenian Catholic Church.
Below are my original posts:
I encourage everyone in our Church to write letters writing campaign to Rome. We are a small Church. A mere dozen letters from our clergy alone would be able to overturn the reformed liturgy in favor of the real liturgy. If we all write letters and each find only 2 more people to write letters we can succeed. I especially encourage our clergy to write since letters from clergy are not ignored by Rome.
Start by obtaining a good copy of the promulgation and cover letter from your pastor. The one on this website is not good enough.
Send copies to the following people (as a start):
His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI
The Apostolic Palace
00120 Vatican City, Europe
His Eminence Cardinal Ignace Moussa Daoud, Prefect
Congregation for the Oriental Churches
Palazzo del Bramante
Via della Conciliazione, 34
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.42.82
Fax: 011.29.06.69.88.43.00
Send separate letters to the following at the same address:
His Excellency Antonio Maria Veglio, Secretary
Mons. Krzystof Nitkiewicz, Undersecretary
And to the following:
His Eminence Cardinal Francis Arinze, Prefect
Congregatio de Cultu Divino et Disciplina Sacramentorum
Palazzo delle Congregazioni
Piazza Pio XII, 10
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.43.16; 011.39.06.69.88.43.18
Fax: 011.39.06.69.88.34.99
His Eminence Cardinal Walter Kasper
Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity
Via dell'Erba, 1
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.30.72; 011.39.06.69.88.42.71
Fax: 011.39.06.69.88.53.65
When I have a chance I will post the mailing information for all the Greek Catholic patriarchs (especially the Ukrainian Patriarch Lubomyr and the Melkite Patriarch Gregorios III) and for our bishops in Europe.
Keep your letters polite and respectful. Make sure they contain no emotion all.
There is a lot of material on this web board to draw from. Write the letter in your own words and focus on the following points:
1. This Reformed Liturgy violates official books, the Ordo Celebrationis, and the Liturgical Instruction.
2. This Reformed Liturgy makes the Liturgy in our Ruthenian Church different than all other Byzantine / Greek Catholics and thus hurts unity within the Catholic Church.
3. This Reformed Liturgy makes the Liturgy in our Ruthenian Church different than all the other Orthodox Churches and thus hurts Catholic / Orthodox unity.
4. The embracement of inclusive language violates Liturgiam Authenticam.
Make sure your letter is no longer than 2 pages. Have someone not from our Church read it. If they don't understand what you are saying neither will the people in Rome.
Make sure you ask questions. Why did they approve a Byzantine Novus Ordo liturgy that is different than the official Ruthenian books? Why did they direct the use of inclusive language that violates Liturgiam Authenticam? Ask them why the official Ruthenian Divine Liturgy is being prohibited at the same time the Holy Father is considering making the Tridentine Mass an equal standard with the Novus Ordo.
Enclose a copy of Archbishop Basil's promulgation letter and the cover letter sent to your pastor so they know what you are talking about.
Do not threaten to leave or withhold your offerings. Take the position that you are a faithful Byzantine Catholic and that you want the official liturgy of our Church. Take the position that you are willing to do whatever it takes to obtain permission from the Vatican for your parish to continue celebrate the official Ruthenian Divine Liturgy.
Use full names and addresses. Make sure the signatures are clear. If you can sent either U.S. Global mail, UPS or FedEx. The special cardboard envelopes will attract attention.
If you think you can manage it petitions do work. Just make sure that every signature and name and address is captured and legible.
Don't sit back and think someone else will write and you can ignore this. YOU NEED TO WRITE YOUR OWN LETTER! YOU NEED TO WRITE YOUR LETTER TODAY!
Dostojno Jest
---
Another address:
His Beatitude, Cardinal Patriarch Lubomyr
The Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church
pl. Sviatoho Yura 5,
Lviv 79000 Ukraine
Phone: (+380) 322 97-97-63
Additional Letter to:
Dionisio Lachovicz (Liakhovych), O.S.B.M., Auxiliary Bishop
General - info@ugcc.org.ua
Press office - press@ugcc.org.ua
Synod of Bishops - synod@ugcc.org.ua
Secretariate of the Sobor - sobor@ugcc.org.ua
I had a pm. We need to write to Patriarch Bartholomew, Bishop Maximos of Pittsburgh (the head of the Orthodox Catholic Dialog).
His All Holiness BARTHOLOMEW
Archbishop of Constantinople, New Rome, and Ecumenical Patriarch
Rum Patrikhanesi, 342 20 Fener- Halic, Istanbul, Turkey
Tel. +90 212 5319670 - 6
Fax. +90 212 5349037
E-mail: Patriarchate@ec-patr.org
Also:
His Eminence, Metropolitan Meliton of Philadelphia.
Tel.: +90 212 6354022
Fax: +90 212 5349037
E-mail: melito@superonline.com
I have been told that the Patriarch is very interested in the activities of the Byzantine Catholics. It does affect the Catholic / Orthodox ecumenical dialog. He will not take kindly to a feminist rewrite of the Divine Liturgy.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 71
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 71 |
... and those of us that don't have a problem with the promulgation should write letters in agreement to it. If half the energy was put into understanding and accepting the changes as is being put froth into rebelling against it, our church could spend more time on important matters, such as preserving vespers, matins and other traditions.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618 |
In all fairness, I do not find the statement and those of us that don't have a problem with the promulgation should write letters in agreement to it. If half the energy was put into understanding and accepting the changes as is being put froth into rebelling against it, our church could spend more time on important matters, such as preserving vespers, matins and other traditions. to be accurate. I know of a multitude of Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Churches, yet only 2 of them have Vespers and Matins. Likewise if those that expend big money and lots of time creating and promulgating the RDL would instead concentrate their efforts on instituting Vespers and Matins, I feel the world would be a better place. Those that oppose the RDL are not Rebelling, but rather are seeking to live the Catholic Faith. Those that have been deemed Rebels are following guidelines from the Vatican. Those that support the RDL are Rebelling against Vatican directives regarding Liturgical Language and regarding being true to authentic Eastern Christianity.
Last edited by InCogNeat3's; 03/10/07 11:10 PM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 856
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 856 |
Dear InCogNeat3,
Actually, the bulk of this year's Cantor Intitute in Pittsburgh has been on the celebration of Matins (an additional session was added on implementing the new books so as not to interfere with the original cursus); during the previous year, the liturgics and music for Vespers were taught. We've cleaned up a quite a bit of the abbreviations and omissions in the books from the Sisters of St. Basil, particularly at Matins. For three years now, weekly materials for the celebration of Vespers have been available including saints' stichera. We developed a set of Octoechos canons for Sunday Matins that received the blessing of BOTH Metropolitan Judson and Metropolitan Nicholas.
Some of us have been working for years on restoring Matins and Vespers - and the biggest roadblocks I've met have not been priests or bishops, but parishioners. (Which is not to say that it wouldn't be a LOT easier to do this if more priests were willing to promote a full liturgical cycle in their churches. I wish more Orthodox parishes here celebrated Matins; our neighborhood church just started at the end of last year.)
Yours in Christ,
Jeff Mierzejewski
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618 |
That is good to hear. However, I assume that the Matins that you are refering to has inclusive language, which is fundamentally flawed. (Some of the flaws of inclusive language are explained in several Vatican documents.) Unfortunately there is a June 29 RDL implementation deadline, however I have yet to hear of a Metroplia wide mandatory deadline for Matins and Vespers.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,134 Likes: 1
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,134 Likes: 1 |
That is good to hear. However, I assume that the Matins that you are refering to has inclusive language, which is fundamentally flawed. (Some of the flaws of inclusive language are explained in several Vatican documents.) Unfortunately there is a June 29 RDL implementation deadline, however I have yet to hear of a Metroplia wide mandatory deadline for Matins and Vespers. I doubt you'll see vespers in the BCC on a large scale anytime soon. Let me explain why. I'm 40 years old. Raised Greek Catholic. Never witnessed a vespers in any parish in my area. As most on this forum know, I'm now Orthodox. There isn't a single OCA parish that DOESN'T celebrate vespers every Saturday in my area. My 76 year old father(cradle and current Greek Catholic) still cannot fathom why I attend vespers every Saturday. He thinks I've gone off the deep end going to church TWICE every weekend. When I try to DRAG him with me to vespers, he practically kicks and screams saying "Vespers is b******t! You're nuts! I never attended a vespers in my life." I kid you not. I can't convince him that it's Byzantine tradition. When I bring up prostrations during lent, he's ready to call the rubber truck! That's why you'll never see vespers implemented in the BCC. 80% of the current membership has no clue that there's more to the Byzantine rite than just Liturgy. Z'Bohom
Last edited by Etnick; 03/11/07 02:05 AM.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,533 Likes: 1
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,533 Likes: 1 |
My priest would be more than happy to celebrate Vespers. However, no one would show up. It's not the priest but the parishioners.
BTW, we aren't alone. I recently meet the new Greek Orthodox priest in my area. He replaced the previous priest. The previous priest had vespers. Now, they stopped again with the vespers. I assume nobody showed up.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 487
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 487 |
That is good to hear. However, I assume that the Matins that you are refering to has inclusive language, which is fundamentally flawed. (Some of the flaws of inclusive language are explained in several Vatican documents.) Unfortunately there is a June 29 RDL implementation deadline, however I have yet to hear of a Metroplia wide mandatory deadline for Matins and Vespers. I doubt you'll see vespers in the BCC on a large scale anytime soon. Let me explain why. I'm 40 years old. Raised Greek Catholic. Never witnessed a vespers in any parish in my area. As most on this forum know, I'm now Orthodox. There isn't a single OCA parish that DOESN'T celebrate vespers every Saturday in my area. My 76 year old father(cradle and current Greek Catholic) still cannot fathom why I attend vespers every Saturday. He thinks I've gone off the deep end going to church TWICE every weekend. When I try to DRAG him with me to vespers, he practically kicks and screams saying "Vespers is b******t! You're nuts! I never attended a vespers in my life." I kid you not. I can't convince him that it's Byzantine tradition. When I bring up prostrations during lent, he's ready to call the rubber truck! That's why you'll never see vespers implemented in the BCC. 80% of the current membership has no clue that there's more to the Byzantine rite than just Liturgy. Z'Bohom Etnick, you are right, if Vespers is started out of the blue without any other fanfare or education, no one will show up because no one will know why they should go. I know a Greek Catholic priest who this past Christmas had Vespers on Christmas Eve (according to the Typikon) and told the congregation that if they wanted to hear all about the Nativity and experience the festal prayers that Vespers and not Liturgy would be where they could hear that. By doing this he got a good turnout because he gave a good reason as to one of the many reasons why Vespers is important. Did every person show up, no, but a lot more than you would expect did and this priest received great feedback. In fact many of the people asked why they had never seen or heard Vespers before and when the next one would be. So it can be done in an educational and informative manner. In most cases it has to come from the clergy. There are many parishes where not a single person even knows about Vespers. The people don't know what they don't know. Our clergy need to step up, and this should be encouraged by all of us including our Bishops. Then we would actually be taking steps towards an authentic place of worship. So it can happen, but not without some proactive clergy sharing with the faithful why they should attend and educating them as well. It would be naive to assume 100% turnout, but with the right process we will be successful. Monomakh
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,231
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,231 |
"Isn't vespers something we have on Good Friday instead of Mass?" I've heard this at my parish.  You're right--if no one comes and there's no education then what is the point?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 706
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 706 |
Perhaps education is a good place to start. If the priest spoke about the place of Vespers in the tradition and how it can actually benefit those that want to grow in the faith and heop them grow closer to Christ in the rectory after DL or included some info in the church bulletin maybe some folks would work up some interest. I'm just guessing. At my parish Vespers takes place at least once a week (twice during the Great Fast season)and is well attended.Many of us are new to the fait but their are some cradle byzcaths that attend regularly also. I'll ask them why they come and if they grew up with it and maybe they'll have some compelling insight that could help others.
Peace,
Indigo
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 618 |
Keep Writing! Keep Praying! Keep Fasting!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 59
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 59 |
I am reposting my original posts that have disappeared down the chain. I just heard this morning that certain powers in Rome are starting to ask questions about what is going on in the Ruthenian Church. If Rome rescinds the RDL we have a good chance for getting the Ruthenian Liturgy mandated.
Below are my original posts:
I encourage everyone in our Church to write letters writing campaign to Rome. We are a small Church. A mere dozen letters from our clergy alone would be able to overturn the reformed liturgy in favor of the real liturgy. If we all write letters and each find only 2 more people to write letters we can succeed. I especially encourage our clergy to write since letters from clergy are not ignored by Rome.
Start by obtaining a good copy of the promulgation and cover letter from your pastor. The one on this website is not good enough.
Send copies to the following people (as a start):
His Holiness, Pope Benedict XVI
The Apostolic Palace
00120 Vatican City, Europe
His Eminence Cardinal Ignace Moussa Daoud, Prefect
Congregation for the Oriental Churches
Palazzo del Bramante
Via della Conciliazione, 34
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.42.82
Fax: 011.29.06.69.88.43.00
Send separate letters to the following at the same address:
His Excellency Antonio Maria Veglio, Secretary
Mons. Krzystof Nitkiewicz, Undersecretary
And to the following:
His Eminence Cardinal Francis Arinze, Prefect
Congregatio de Cultu Divino et Disciplina Sacramentorum
Palazzo delle Congregazioni
Piazza Pio XII, 10
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.43.16; 011.39.06.69.88.43.18
Fax: 011.39.06.69.88.34.99
His Eminence Cardinal Walter Kasper
Pontifical Council for Promoting Christian Unity
Via dell'Erba, 1
00193 Roma, Italia, Europe
Telephone: 011.39.06.69.88.30.72; 011.39.06.69.88.42.71
Fax: 011.39.06.69.88.53.65
When I have a chance I will post the mailing information for all the Greek Catholic patriarchs (especially the Ukrainian Patriarch Lubomyr and the Melkite Patriarch Gregorios III) and for our bishops in Europe.
Keep your letters polite and respectful. Make sure they contain no emotion all.
There is a lot of material on this web board to draw from. Write the letter in your own words and focus on the following points:
1. This Reformed Liturgy violates official books, the Ordo Celebrationis, and the Liturgical Instruction.
2. This Reformed Liturgy makes the Liturgy in our Ruthenian Church different than all other Byzantine / Greek Catholics and thus hurts unity within the Catholic Church.
3. This Reformed Liturgy makes the Liturgy in our Ruthenian Church different than all the other Orthodox Churches and thus hurts Catholic / Orthodox unity.
4. The embracement of inclusive language violates Liturgiam Authenticam.
Make sure your letter is no longer than 2 pages. Have someone not from our Church read it. If they don't understand what you are saying neither will the people in Rome.
Make sure you ask questions. Why did they approve a Byzantine Novus Ordo liturgy that is different than the official Ruthenian books? Why did they direct the use of inclusive language that violates Liturgiam Authenticam? Ask them why the official Ruthenian Divine Liturgy is being prohibited at the same time the Holy Father is considering making the Tridentine Mass an equal standard with the Novus Ordo.
Enclose a copy of Archbishop Basil's promulgation letter and the cover letter sent to your pastor so they know what you are talking about.
Do not threaten to leave or withhold your offerings. Take the position that you are a faithful Byzantine Catholic and that you want the official liturgy of our Church. Take the position that you are willing to do whatever it takes to obtain permission from the Vatican for your parish to continue celebrate the official Ruthenian Divine Liturgy.
Use full names and addresses. Make sure the signatures are clear. If you can sent either U.S. Global mail, UPS or FedEx. The special cardboard envelopes will attract attention.
If you think you can manage it petitions do work. Just make sure that every signature and name and address is captured and legible.
Don't sit back and think someone else will write and you can ignore this. YOU NEED TO WRITE YOUR OWN LETTER! YOU NEED TO WRITE YOUR LETTER TODAY!
Dostojno Jest
---
Another address:
His Beatitude, Cardinal Patriarch Lubomyr
The Ukrainian Greek Catholic Church
pl. Sviatoho Yura 5,
Lviv 79000 Ukraine
Phone: (+380) 322 97-97-63
Additional Letter to:
Dionisio Lachovicz (Liakhovych), O.S.B.M., Auxiliary Bishop
General - info@ugcc.org.ua
Press office - press@ugcc.org.ua
Synod of Bishops - synod@ugcc.org.ua
Secretariate of the Sobor - sobor@ugcc.org.ua
I had a pm. We need to write to Patriarch Bartholomew, Bishop Maximos of Pittsburgh (the head of the Orthodox Catholic Dialog).
His All Holiness BARTHOLOMEW
Archbishop of Constantinople, New Rome, and Ecumenical Patriarch
Rum Patrikhanesi, 342 20 Fener- Halic, Istanbul, Turkey
Tel. +90 212 5319670 - 6
Fax. +90 212 5349037
E-mail: Patriarchate@ec-patr.org
Also:
His Eminence, Metropolitan Meliton of Philadelphia.
Tel.: +90 212 6354022
Fax: +90 212 5349037
E-mail: melito@superonline.com
I have been told that the Patriarch is very interested in the activities of the Byzantine Catholics. It does affect the Catholic / Orthodox ecumenical dialog. He will not take kindly to a feminist rewrite of the Divine Liturgy.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,226
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,226 |
I am reposting my original posts that have disappeared down the chain. I just heard this morning that certain powers in Rome are starting to ask questions about what is going on in the Ruthenian Church. If Rome rescinds the RDL we have a good chance for getting the Ruthenian Liturgy mandated. This is good news indeed Dostojno! I used your information when I submitted my letters to Rome. Again, I urge all Ruthenian Catholics to write, write, write!!! I have been told that the Patriarch is very interested in the activities of the Byzantine Catholics. It does affect the Catholic / Orthodox ecumenical dialog. He will not take kindly to a feminist rewrite of the Divine Liturgy. Thank God for Pope Benedict! May he hear the voices of those who have been scandalized!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,441 Likes: 5
Cantor Member
|
|
Cantor Member
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,441 Likes: 5 |
I also don't think it would hurt to make sure to mention the bishop who heads the committee since I have been told he has "been taken to the woodshed" by Rome in the past...but what do I know...
Chris
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,373
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 2,373 |
Interesting, but I would be surprised if Rome actually did anything.
Xpucmoc Bockpece!
Ungcsertezs
|
|
|
|
|
