www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Chaldean Catholic priest and three deacons were gunned down

I'm moved to write a troparion and kontakion for these new martyrs. Can anyone tell me what the English equivalents of their names would be?

Priest Ragheed Ganni
Subdeacon Basman Yousef Daud
Subdeacon Wahid Hanna Isho
Subdeacon Gassan Isam Bidawed

what a tragedy, God receive the souls of these holy martyrs.
the Chaldeans have every right to stay in Iraq, they come from an ethnic group that has been in that land from the remotest antiquity (Abraham the Patriarch was a Chaldean).
our government seems to be more interested in Arab oil than Arab Christian blood.
Much Love,
Jonn

Well our government is never one to care about Christianity...the bombing of Serbian Orthodox churches and monasteries is yet another example...

Though I don't know if we are to blame for the evil of Muslims against Christians. The only thing dictators like Saddam Hussein manage to do is instill fear to commit crime in people--a bandaid of sorts for people to live harmoniously with one another. This is not a long term solution, however, that changes the heart or psyche. If the Muslim religion, in its mosques, does not take a stand on this type of thing, but silently and not so silently encourages it for the sake of conversion, there will never be any hope in this chaos of collective, cultic thinking that is called Islam.

Perhaps if there were a strong enough lobby of some ecumenical sort to care about the welfare of Christians elsewhere...

Alice

Edward,

My guess would be that Michael Thoma, Alex/East-Syrian-rite Mar Thoma Catholic, Rony/Chaldean Catholic, Khalid/ChaldeanCatholic, Yuhannon, or Phil/Mor Ephrem are the ones most likely to be able to offer a translation of the names. If none of them post to the thread, you might want to try PMing one of them.

Many years,

Neil

Our American economy, and that of much of the world, has a healthy demand for Arab oil. Germany, France and Russia conspired with Hussein to evade the Food-for-Oil program. The blood of innocent Iraqis is on the hands of many and there is no one guilty party - whether or not one opposed or supported the war.

The murder of the Iraqi Christian community has been carried out by Muslim fanatics. Muslim fanaticism has been with us, killing Christians, since the days of Mohammed. Hussein permitted religion in Iraq, up to a point. The Shia were always oppressed. Hussein saw them as allies of Shia Iran and potential threats. The Iraqi Sunnis were basically secular and were the ones (not all of them) who lived "high off the hog", so to speak.

I have long been disgusted with the Bush Administration and Congress in how they treat the Iraqi Christians who want to emigrate - they basically can't come to the US (unless they get into Mexico first, then if this immigration bill passes, they could probably all come).

The real blame for the terrorist acts and the murders lies with the radical Muslims. Point to one party or another for contributing to it, but the blood is on the hands of the radical Muslims - as it has been for 1400 years.

I'll repeat - Queen Isabella and King Jan Sobieski were the most successful in dealing with radical Islam - they knocked the snot out of it on the battlefield.

The name "Ragheed" doesn't really have an English equivalent. It's Slavic equivalent is "Milos", however.
The closest English name to "Basman" would be "Gil" or "Gwyn".
The closest English name to "Wahid" is "Angus".
The closest English equivalent to the name "Gassan" would be "Oliver".

Arabic names are much like Hebrew ones: they still carry meaning in the current language. This makes it difficult to find equivalents in other languages, which no longer have this close association of meaning and the spoken language.

Why look for equivalents, though? We don't translate any of the earlier Greek, Aramaic, Latin, or even Slavic names into Anglo-Saxon or Celtic equivalents. For example, we don't call the saint remembered today (Cyril) "Meredith" or "Tierney"--all of which mean 'lord' or 'lordly'. Remember them as they were named.

Ah, thanks! I'm wondering though - were 'Ragheed', 'Basman', 'Wahid' and 'Gassan' their family names, or their baptismal names? The last bits of their names look to me more like baptismal names that the first bits.

Edward,

Those ('Ragheed', 'Basman', 'Wahid' and 'Gassan') are personal names.

As to the surnames: "Isho" does indeed have some use as a personal name; Bidawed in several variant spellings is a surname indicating descent from an ancestor named David - as is Daud (often rendered as "Dowd" in English by immigration officials at Ellis Island in of the early 20th century)

Many years,

Neil

Everlasting memory to the New Hieromartyr Ragheed and companion subdeacons.

I think many are missing an important part of the story. At least, I see it as important. Here we have 3 sub-deacons acting as "body guards" for a priest.

I think this has interesting important implications.

Please remember these Martyrs. Please bring peace to the this land.

Maybe America should come back to Christ?
No amount of killing will serve the purposes of endless greed. Greed and keeping power cannot coexist with peace. Neither side is strong enough to prevail. There is a way out if we sacrifice the greedy reasons we went in.

Ray,

With all due respect, the important part of the story is that Father Ragheed, Shamasha Basman, Shamasa Wahid, and Shamasa Gassan were martyred. While your idea that the Church should reinstitute the military aspect of the Knights of Saint John (or any other of the chivalrous orders) to serve as personal bodyguards for the clergy in places like Iran sounds nice, it is unrealistic and not going to happen.

For one thing, the Church needs not be in the business of insinuating another paramilitary body into a conflict that it wants to see brought to an end. For another, those who are members of the chivalrous orders are hardly trained, equipped, or likely to be enthused about putting themselves at such risk. Such bodies are principally populated by older, overweight gentlemen of substance who bear their titles by reason of their generosity to the Church's charitable endeavors - not due to any military prowess or any other skill that would serve the notion that you are promoting.

Having been involved in the provision of personal security at various times over the past 4 decades, including to hierarchs, I can assure you that it is neither a task to be lightly undertaken nor one to be assumed without a significant measure of expertise. Doing so serves no one's interests, the protected or the protector.

Many years,

Neil

Of course that is the most important part of the story. I am not suggesting it isn't. However, there is another important part of the story which I mentioned.


It's happening now. Unrealistic or not these clergy are setting help in the defense of their lives. This article proves that point.


I could not agree more! This is a job for professionals.


Of course they are not trained, equipped, or enthused about putting themselves at such risk. I am not suggesting they should! What I am suggesting is that some financial funding be provided to help train these priests. Perhaps something as simple as to know when to check underneath your car before you start it. Also, they could provide training from experts on how to properly exit the Church without putting yourself at risk. For example, knowing how to come to and from Church in a random manner (i.e. time of day and routes), etc...

Finally, I don't think it is unreasonable to provide priest, deacons, etc with bullet proof vest in the middle of a combat zone. I don't know how much these things cost but I'll bet they are expensive.

Those old "chivalrous orders" may not be able to provide protection but they could provide funding and a possible organization structure.

If any of these kinds of services could help save the life of one priest wouldn't it be worth it?

Again it is just a thought, and I think the tone of your comment against my thought was some what uncharitable. Perhaps I read the post wrong...

Irish President's Letter to Iraqi Priest's Funeral

"Let Us Recognize Father Ragheed's Sacrifice for What it Was"

DUBLIN, Ireland, JUNE 9, 2007 (Zenit.org).- Here is the message Irish President Mary McAleese sent on the occasion of the Requiem Mass for Father Ragheed Ganni, held Thursday at the Pontifical Irish College in Rome.

Father Ganni and three deacons were shot and killed in Mosul, Iraq, on Sunday after Mass.

* * *

I was in Rome last weekend when the tragic news came through that Father Ragheed Ganni, someone I first met in Lough Derg some years ago, and a former student of the Irish College, had been killed with three of the deacons who worked with him -- one of those deacons his cousin.

Father Ragheed's father and mother, and all his family, must suffer great pain at this time. Their loss is all the more terrible for the suddenness and evil manner of his death. May Father Ragheed's dear parents be sustained by their deep faith.

The manner of Father Ragheed's death will be mourned in particular by the people of Iraq -- and as his funeral mass in northern Iraq demonstrated -- by the people of the whole region. Father Ragheed returned to live and minister in the ancient city of Mosul, in the parish of the Holy Spirit, in full consciousness of the risks.

There had been a bomb attack on the parish church as recently as Pentecost Sunday. Let us recognize Father Ragheed's sacrifice for what it was. Equally, we should reflect in truth on the sequence of events that has brought so many communities in Iraq to the edge of survival. As we follow the daily tragedies of Iraq, we should pray, as Benedict XVI said, that this "costly sacrifice will inspire ... a renewed resolve to reject the ways of hatred and violence."

In the middle of the forced exodus to Connaught in the 1650s, a Gaelic poet (Fear Dorcha O'Meall�in) wrote about the possibility of faith even under dire circumstances of persecution and social dislocation (An Duanaire). He spoke too of God's oneness:

"People of my heart, stand steady,
Don't make play of your distress.
Moses got what he requested,
Religious freedom, even from Pharaoh.

"Identical Israel's God and ours,
One God there was and still remains.
Here or Westward God is one,
One God ever and shall be."

Father Ragheed Ganni's death challenges us to work for reconciliation between faiths and to create a world where each human life is revered. The process of our own island's reconciliation that began so promisingly in Belfast a few short weeks ago may hold out hope for Father Ganni's beloved, but troubled, homeland.

These are days of sorrow for a caring family, for a lacerated country, and for so many others. But Father Ragheed lived his life by a commandment to love. In our sorrow we remember, on this feast of Corpus Christi, his sacrifice, his willing sacrifice in service of his faith.

I thank God today for the blessing that has been given us in Father Ragheed Ganni.

"Ar dheis D� go raibh a ainm d�lis" (May his faithful soul be on God's right side).

Mary McAleese
President of Ireland

[Text adapted]

ZE07060901 - 2007-06-09

Dear Richard Anthony,

The United States, and consequentially the world, is dependant on oil for it's survival. You mention greed, yet the greatest thing we have to fear is a depression. Should that occur, then millions upon millions will either die of starvation, or through wars in order to survive.

It's funny how the very people that are so adamantly against us drilling for oil in Alaska, because of the environment, are the same one's that are screaming about how we are dependant on Middle Eastern oil. I wish they'd make up their minds...but it's politics as usual.

As for the situation in Iraq, had the countries, such as Russia, Germany and especially France and it's lobbying throughout the world, enforced the sanctions on Iraq rather than use them to fill their pockets, we might not have been in this situation. Those countries didn't though, instead when our soldiers went in, they found warehouses filled with medicine, and the hospitals empty of it.

If I recall correctly, everyone was upset before the war on how the sanctions were hurting the children and the sick people of Iraq.


God Bless,

Zenovia