www.byzcath.org Forums Mysteries: The Life of Worship Vespers, Matins & the Divine Liturgy The Revised Divine Liturgy Interesting experience at local BCC.

After returning to the southern US after living up north for a bit, my wife and I made it to a nearby BCC (not that nearby, but the only one even close). We knew the RDL was now in place, but we were looking forward to the experience of the liturgy, hearing the singing, the beauty of it, even if they did revise it (after having been attending the local RCC). What we got was something we did not expect.

The entire liturgy was read, there was no singing, not even an attempt at singing. We heard one lady behind us say "this is confusing". And frankly, it was, and very disappointing. From the prospective of myself who converted from protestantism to the BCC, this was completly unattractive, and definatley not "heaven on earth", as my old priest who brought us into the faith used to say.

Has anyone else experienced this ?

It took approximately two weeks in our parish in Binghamton before people were finding their place in the new books and the singing was starting to return to what it was before. On the other hand, some parishes are apparently waiting till the last minute to use the new books, and some pastors have said they do not intend to provide any guidance in using them.

You might need more information to find out whether this is a chronic problem in this particular parish, or a passing phenomenon.

Yours in Christ,
Jeff

"The entire liturgy was read, there was no singing, not even an attempt at singing."

This phenomenon is, of course, completely illegal.

Prof. J. Michael Thompson
Byzantine Catholic Seminary
Pittsburgh, PA

Ahh...are you now designated as the Grand Inquisitor, Professor?

What is the penalty for a parish priest not forcing a Church full of octagenarians to change?...or not yielding to weak liturgical theology?...etc.

Mandatory impoverishment...loss of pension....loss of health care?

It has come to my attention that you folks are encouraging selected laity to detail the levels of compliance of their priests, is there truth in that?

What do you do in parishes that have no cantors?...or parishes where the cantor quits rather than suffer the music or inflict it on anyone else?

I hear the music at Bishop Dudicks funeral mass was ghastly...or was that ghostly?....ahhhwell...He didn't have to sit through it and that is a blessing.

M.

A recited liturgy is more prayerful than that horrible music in the new pew book. At least if you recite it no one will laugh at the bad accents. It sounds like we just got off the boat!

Dear Desert Byzantine?

You've made this claim (about "bad accents") several times now, and others have repeated it. Can you provide some examples, please?

Yours in Christ,
Jeff Mierzejewski

I'm sure the folks at this parish didn't expect the Spanish Inquisition...

Whose weapons are fear, surprise, and a fanatical devotion to the new pew books!

Bring out...the rack!

They'll be singing in no time--or else...the comfy chair!

Some of the music is just awful, Jeff. A+W+F+U+L

Unsingable

Depressingly banal

And not all of it is a restoration.

Some of the "accent" problems comes from a marked loss of power in the translation itself.

If the words have no power, the lines will have no power, even if perfectly accented.

Perhaps you could join the rest of us out here in the real world. I know they are not paying you for your boundless loyalty. From your own accounting, you pay them for the privilege.

Mary

Dear Mary,

No, I asked Desert Byzantine a very specific question. You mentioned parishes without cantors; old books or new, that is a rather wild anomaly and QUITE irregular in our tradition. The solution is to find someone willing to serve as cantor - and they will end up having to learn new things, whether using the old music or new.

The specific question I asked was: Could you please provide some example of "bad accents"? Saying "it's all terrible" and providing not a single example over the course of six months sounds less like constructive criticism and more like a knee-jerk "I hate brussels sprouts, nyah" argument. That's why I'd like a specific answer.

Jeff

Jeff,

My comments about this new liturgy have gone and are going directly to the bishops. You have absolutely no credibility. People have posted lots of examples here of bad accents and you keep pretending that this is the first you have heard about it.

Desert Byzantine

I'm not about to give a specific answer at the moment. But inadvertently I found myself listening to about 10 minutes of a recording of a service according to the Revised Liturgy from a large parish, celebrated by a priest (who is a friend of long standing and whom I therefore will not name). Just listening to it was excruciatingly painful. One of the "accent" problems is not so much the stress on one syllable rather than another, but the stress on one word rather than another - which destroys the syntax.

Fr. Serge

Dear Desert Byzantine,

That IS odd. I've been reading this forum fairly steadily for years, and the only specific "bad accent" I've seen claimed was a single phrase that I mentioned preferring a different translation for. I believe you said several months ago that there were "lots of examples" and I STILL haven't seen any. Credibility or not, I'd like to see you come up with one or two examples, or point me to the threads where these examples were posted.

I know of quite a few bad accents in the old music, both syllabic and phrase, and my chant teachers "back in the day" pointed mANY of them out and recommended ways to finesse them. I would honestly be interested to know what you are looking at that rates such accusations.

Father Serge, your blessing!

It is certainly possible, either due to badly written music or to bad singing, to completely destroy a phrase; I heard this last week at a local Orthodox church, and it happens at ours as well. I would appreciate hearing your own list of such sore points, privately if necessary - in order to either find weak spots in the musical settings, or places for cantors to exercise caution.

Yours in Christ,
Jeff

Does the Ruthenian Church have Liturgical police officers?!?

Someone once said to me that the fact we are now chained to these new pew books, makes our Church very episcopalian in nature.

Whatever does this mean?

Judging by the reactions from the vostochniki in my old parish when a newcomer suggested we just have a "Low (i.e. recited) Liturgy" as provided for in our pew booklet, there certainly was a posse forming!



Jeff