www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Poll: Where do you stand on the RDL?

I shall try to maintain the requested charity of post but I do have a few observations:

1. If you were "driven from your parish" by the RDL, then you were not much of a Catholic in the first place. I'm sorry if that sounds overbearing and rude, but I cannot doctrinally, after years of study to overcome my Protestant baggage of hatred against the Catholic Faith, agree with those who feel the need to leave. My study of the Holy Sriptures has convinced me of a eklessiology which is simply not found in the Holy Orthodox Faith, regardless of its beauty. To be true to my deepest inner convictions, which SHOULD be that which makes any Catholic a Catholic, I must stay.

2. I have yet to see anything in the RDL which I would consider to be soul damning if I should repeat it. Perhaps some of the louder voices of dissent present here could help me understand what is so bad about the RDL that it warrants leaving?

3. Perhaps I am one of the lucky ones. At St. Ann's we are not noticing a great disparity between the music of the RDL and what we have been doing for years, probably because Fr. Mike was not exactly warm to some of the suggestions which previously came from the eparchial offices.

4. And finally, if the RDL does not offer a substantial threat to your soul (as one poster here has insisted that it does) then to what point do you leave? Is our fidelity to Truth based on musical and liturgical preference? Does the changing of a few words in the Liturgy represent such a threat that you must strike the tents?

I'm sorry. I just don't "get it".

I would dearly love some responses here, since I am in a learning mode about all this. Our priest has been publishing explanations in each Sunday bulletin, covering the various changes. Perhaps if your priests were doing the same, you might feel less threatened.

Oh, and perhaps someone will take me to task for my intial and vocal opposition to the RDL. I am still not completely happy with it (mostly due to the horrid use of "inclusive language" and watering down of the Creed) but unless it is proven to me that the use of this Liturgy threatens my soul, then I agee with the poster who admonished us for not obeying our bishops. I think it is all to easy to be a rebel (just ask Luther, Calvin, or the myriads of children they have spawned who continue to oppose the Church for their miscreant theologies). It is far harder to stay and pray and keep a knowledgeable and quiet eye on things.

Brother Ed

Come on, Ung!
You don't recall Father Why Do We...?
Ridiculous simplistic questions by supposed church members named Anna, Mary or John?
Filler...
LOLOL!!!

Sam

Recluse,

your intuition and instinct on this are correct and uncanny.

A little over a year ago, I stopped by St. Elias in Brampton, Ontario. The church was locked and empty, but downstairs in the hall was a woman and her kids doing some work. She let me in and allowed me to visit the church. On the way out, I spotted a pile of books (you can't call them pew books there, there aren't any pews )and after doing a little perusing of them, I looked in the front cover. Now, I can't dance, draw, or paint, but the Lord did bless me with a good memory. Low and behold, the names Rev. Peter Galadza and J. Michael Thompson were there amongst a few other names. I believe that the book was "The Divine Liturgy: An Anthology for Worship", (Ottawa: Sheptytsky Institute of Eastern Christian Studies, 2004).
Keep asking the right questions.

Monomakh

ps - I don't think you or I will be getting any requests from BCW for an RDL review anytime soon.

If you visit the Sheptytsky Institute's publications [web.ustpaul.uottawa.ca] page you will find the "Anthology" - 2nd item on the list.

_____
Ребята, давайте жить дружно.

IMHO

I love the Liturgy and accept my church fathers' decision. I guess if I was sooo against it, as I have read many here, I would consider entering the system to make the changes you feel are needed from within.

I, on the other hand, put faith in my church leaders and accept the decisions they make on my behalf to create a worship environment that is perfect in the eyes of God.

I have been reading and reading the responses here on the liturgy and see a few good points, but mostly I just see a lot of people who hate change and the authority of the church leaders and seem like genuinely angry people.

Again, IMHO

Ruthenian Reformation. I like that moniker. Orosz Reformatush!

Ungcsertezs

83 people as of right now. That's two Pennsylvania parishes worth of people, isn't it? I'd say that is no small sum, especially when the people are probably among the most active in their parishes.

Where do I stand on the RDL?

Oh, my first choice would be on the head and neck, preferably while wearing logging boots or spiked golf cleats.

Alexandr

I don't know. I'm not in Pennsylvania, but I'm pretty darn active, and I don't have any major problems with the RDL.

You are active in your parish and you are here voting and expressing your experiences and opinions. I'd say you fit the board's demographics. Thanks for voting!

Brother Ed,

Do not feel badly about your comments. I was trying to decide how to charitably also put similar ideas into words. Although I also may not agree with the selection of a chosen word, or would prefer three verses to an antiphon; most changes to the Liturgy are not enough to make me feel differently about how I interact with our Lord during the celebration. If someone approaches worship with a negative attitude, how can they expect to receive the glory of the eucharist? Do these minor changes actually blacken one's heart to the point of having to leave the church of their heritage in order to fulfil their relationship with God?

Larger issues regarding the Byzantine church should be being addressed. Why do we have a congrgation of 100 during holy week, 50 on a Sunday and 25 on a Holy Day of Obligation? Why in 40 years of attending services are congregations exposed to Matins and/or Vespers only during Holy Week? Where is the education of our youth regarding liturgies, commandments, sacrements and laws of the church (along with our heritage)? Are those voicing displeasure with the revised liturgy willing to volunteer to cantor, sing in the choir or educate our youth?

May we take a moment and ask for guidance on how we can enrich our Byzantine faith instead of how we can condemn those who are trying.

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Your comments are interesting for me in this way -- as a convert to the Faith, I had an awful case of "convert fever". I wanted to do everything I could in the parish.

Here's the problem. I think I offended some folks because I was just too "over the top" with it all. On the other hand, there are those who won't even come over to the parish hall for a coffee and donut after first liturgy. I don't understand that, given that we are supposed to be family.

The old debate....just how DO we get people to be active?

Can you blame them? Parishes with older congregations who are used to some Slavonic now have none? I think they have every right to be angry.

92 people here have voted. Less than 10 people have voted for the the RDL and the new music. There are many that are not in favor. How does the Archeparch expect to gloss over these facts?

U-C

As to numbers - if you want to play the numbers game in the first place, I suggesting asking your Congressman's secretary how many letters from how many different people (I mean, of course, rational, courteous letters which present a specific issue for the Congressman's attention, perhaps enclosing some support material for the letter-writer's position) for the Congressman to take serious notice. The answer is apt to surprise you.

Fr. Serge

91-93 members voted. keep voting, as the Polls are still open.

U-C