www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Global Warming is a Scam

So says the founder of the Weather Channel

Let the bullets fly!!!

http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/comments_about_global_warming/

http://www.kusi.com/about/bios/weather/1838191.html

I agree with him!

It is all about getting control of the people by the liberal parts of the US. The more of 'your' money they get in taxes and such, the more you have to go to them for services. The less freedom you have. The more control they have over you!

It's that simple.

Dear Dr. Eric and Pani Rose,

I read the articles that you agreed with.

I am not a scientist like the author of those articles. But even I can make some observations.

Specifically, the winters here in northwestern Ohio are warmer than they were in the 1970s (when I was growing up).

In the 1970s, we used to have cold, snowy winters. I remember the first snow occurring in November, and I remember seeing snow on the ground (5 - 12 inches) from around the middle of December till the end of February. And, I remember people treating that as normal.

Over the last 30 years, however, the winters here have become warmer. Yes, we have had some blizzards in that time; the winter of 1998-1999 particularly stands out. But, by and large, it seems milder. It is not a given anymore that we will have a white Christmas. Temperatures in the 40s (Fahrenheit) can and do last well into December. Snowfall is limited to a handful of storms per year, and the snow doesn't seem to be as much, and it doesn't seem to last as long on the ground. Maybe I'm wrong or fuzzy in my reminiscences, I but I clearly remember this:

On New Year's Eve last year (31 December 2006), I found a blooming dandelion flower growing in a field. It was warm enough that people were wearing shorts outside. It should have been below freeing temperatures with snow and ice everywhere.

And that is just in my area.

There are odd things happening with the weather around the world.

-- Glaciers in Europe, Africa (Mt. Kilimanjaro) and South America are melting. They had previously been there for centuries.

-- Siberia and Alaska and northern Canada are getting warmer too. Ice is melting that used to always be there; the permafrost is melting for longer periods of time than it used too; plants and insects from more temperate latitudes are able to live farther and farther north; etc.

-- Meanwhile, the American southeast and Rocky Mountains have been experiencing droughts. I remember living along the Front Range of Colorado Rockies in the middle of the 1990s. There was a daily thunderstorm (with lots of rain) every afternoon during the spring and most of the summer. That was normal. Now, it doesn't rain there nearly as much; it is considered to be unusual for a thunderstorm in the afternoon, as I discovered two years ago.

--And, Europe has faced heat waves and fires like it hasn't seen before. This summer, Greece burned. That usually doesn't happen.

-- Etc.

Now, I don't think "the sky is falling" as Dr. Coleman put it. Also, I agree with him that this is a matter of science and not belief. Yet, the facts are that the climate around the world has been getting warmer.

That is significant.

If this continues, it will be even more significant.

And what is behind all of change? Sunspots? Maybe. A normal cycle in the earth's climate, hitherto undetected? Maybe.

But, maybe, mankind's pollution of the atmosphere has something to do with it. Mankind's industrial production has increased dramatically in the last 100 years, especially in the last 50 years. Maybe all the junk that we have been put into the atmosphere isn't just going away. Maybe it lingers in the air, making it denser; and thus more able to hold more heat. And maybe our clear-cutting of nature's filtering systems for the air -- the forests-- is making the situation worse. And maybe the process is now accelerating (as the data from the Arctic seems to suggest) because natural reservoirs of greenhouses gasses are being released because of the warming in global temperatures. For example, the methane locked in the tundra as frozen swamp gas melting and being released into the atmosphere because the permafrost is melting for longer periods of time than in the past.

Etc.

From all of this, I conclude that global warming is a reality, that it is caused in large measure by mankind's pollution of the atmosphere, that climate change is resulting, and that we as a species must respond actively if we are going to slow down or reverse this from getting worse.

-- John

There was another topic here earlier regarding this whole "global warming" business.

Glaciers naturally advance and retreat over time. And the planet naturally has heating and cooling trends.

This is just another one of those heating trends and that's it. Just 20 years ago, I remember climatologists predicting an upcoming ice age - and now it's all changed because two many suburban soccer moms are spewing greenhouse gases out of the back of their SUVs.

Look at climate data from the 40's and compare it to today. And let's just continue to ignore the Mideval Warming Period that Global Warming Zealots continue to try to sweep under the rug.

Also, when looking at "climate data," as stated in another thread, one needs to look also at the installation of the weather gathering instruments. Where once a Stevenson Screen stood in an empty field, the field is now a sea of concrete. That concrete can and will skew the data to indicate higher temperatures.

Both sides of this issue are very well entrenched, and unfortunately, I don't think any amount of "internet arguing" is going to sway John's opinion. Nor, will any of his argument be persuasive to me.

If anything, the only common ground that we can reach is that we must all be good Christian Stewards to our environment and natural resources. (Of course, how one defines that can be another 12 page thread...)

I really can't help but wonder if the reason why so many people on this forum refuse to accept the idea of global warming is because they don't like the messenger.

Ryan

Priest Algore should not be promoting Simony. So, no, I don't like him because of his actions.

More to the point, when most of the scientific community disagrees with his conclusions why should I pay much attention to what Fr. Gore has to say?

CDL

Well, I really don't like Al Gore either. I also have a problem with Al Gore and others in his camp who seem to think they know not only that we are experiencing climate change in many places across the globe, but just to what extent human behavior is the cause. OTOH, it seems to me that many people are refusing to acknowledge that human behavior is doing a great deal of harm to the earth because they don't like those who are bringing the message. To me, it's sort of like cutting of your nose to spite your own face. I don't know the extent to which warming trends that are happening in some places are due to human behavior, and to what extent they're due to normal, cyclical trends. I don't know that anyone knows. However, it seems absurd to me to deny that there are warming trends in at least some parts of the planet. It also seems premature to rule out the possibility that we are at least partly responsible for that trend, just as I believe it's premature to claim to know the exact extent to which we are responsible.

Ryan

"I know I am correct."

Sound a bit arrogant and presumptuous to me. I hope his claims that we will know in a few decades that global warming is a scam are true. However, when I read the article, I can't help but suspect that he has motives of his own that are based in his own prejudices.

Ryan

There are limits to science and our understanding of nature. The problem with much of the rhetoric and widely used claims about global warming is that they exceed the boundaries of science. When the political activist exceeds the boundaries of science when speaking of scientific matters, false impressions on the nature of things will be implanted in the popular culture.

The activists may find justification in their rhetoric and the call for action for radical change. When they are speaking as political activists, whether or not they are politicians, lobbyists, or opinion makers, they can be fairly dismissed or disputed. The problem is that since they frame their arguments as scientific fact, when in fact it is a particular interpretation of a limited amount of data, a disagreement is too often treated as a heresy. The person disagreeing is often labeled as being unreasoned and a dissenter and is outrightly dismissed.

Maybe the political climate is such that no debate will be fruitful on the issue of the nature of climate change. It may be after a few decades that a number of people can look on the issue with a clear head. Without that clarity it will be impossible to have an argument on the matter and both sides will continually talk past each other.

Terry

One needs to look at the science. If one does one can see not "global warming" but "global climate change". Parts of the earth are growing warmer and other parts are growing cooler. This change is very natural and expected. Further, if one examines the change one can see history repeating itself. Just like there are "30 year floods", "100 year floods" and "1000 year floods" there are cyclical patterns of global weather. There are short cycles that man can observe (less snow now then 30 years ago here in North America but eventually we will have snowier winters again) within longer cycles that man does not live long enough to observe for himself (in the Middle Ages Europe was about 10 degrees warmer and there were wonderful vineyards in the northern areas and Greenland was green).

The problem with the "sky is falling" global warming radicals is that they are not basing their claim on solid science, but rather on computer models that are very unreliable. The fact that so many climatologists become ostracized when they reject the political demands of the global warming radicals should speak volumes. We Christians need to reject their pseudo-religion of "Church of Global Warming" and instead speak to need to be good stewards of the earth's resources.

My dad is 82, he remembers going to the 'picture shows' when he was a kid, and seeing news reels that the glaciers in the poles were melting and the earth was warming. How many times have they said sence then it is warming, no it's cooling, It happens, not too many years ago in the major news magazines, they were writing articles that the earth was cooling.

I mean, come on!

I agree.

-- John

I only posted the article to foster discussion.

When I was 6 (25 years ago) it was so cold and it snowed so hard that the roads all drifted over. My dad had to park his Subaru and use his work duffel bag as a sled and push himself home for five miles. The lake in the back yard was frozen solid and we played on it for my birthday. The lake barely froze last year.

So, yes things are warmer. The real question is why. Is the sun hotter? Are we polluting the atmosphere? Are there normal variations like the ice ages? Even if the US shuts down entirely, does that mean that China and India will?

Interesting questions, especially the last one . . .

And that gets me thinking about another question. It was touched on in another thread, but I would really like to hear your ideas on this (anyone, but especially Dr. Eric):

What can ordinary people do, pragmatically, to be good stewards of the earth?

-- John