The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
ElijahHarvest, Nickel78, Trebnyk1947, John Francis R, Keinn
6,150 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 1,082 guests, and 72 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
by orthodoxsinner2, September 30
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
by Veronica.H, April 24
Byzantine Catholic Outreach of Iowa
Exterior of Holy Angels Byzantine Catholic Parish
Church of St Cyril of Turau & All Patron Saints of Belarus
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics35,506
Posts417,454
Members6,150
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 5 of 5 1 2 3 4 5
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678
Likes: 1
L
Member
Member
L Offline
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 4,678
Likes: 1
"Aquinas' views on the problem of evil and predestination (God does not will the eternal salvation of all) are incompatible with the Eastern Christian doctrines of man and salvation."

Even if we were to agree with you that Aquinas taught that, it is still the private interpretation of a private theologian and carries no official weight.

Alexis

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 528
Member
Member
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 528
Originally Posted by Logos - Alexis
"Aquinas' views on the problem of evil and predestination (God does not will the eternal salvation of all) are incompatible with the Eastern Christian doctrines of man and salvation."

Even if we were to agree with you that Aquinas taught that, it is still the private interpretation of a private theologian and carries no official weight.

Alexis

Excellent point. Quoting a saint from the West or from the East is a pretty common method for dismissing the other side. We can quote Tertullian and still take valuable points from him even as we dismiss (or understand in historical context) his anti-Hellenistic or later heretical statements.

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 118
Member
Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 118
Quote
Even if we were to agree with you that Aquinas taught that, it is still the private interpretation of a private theologian and carries no official weight.

I was using that conclusion to shed light upon the different theological frameworks and methodologies at work here. For an example of an unambiguously dogmatic disagreement, I would cite his work Against the Greeks which advocates the Filioque and Papal Supremacy.

We cannot forget that every doctrine has implicit Trinitarian and Christological implications. Papal infallibility, for example, is the restriction of a particular divine charism/energy (not transmitted through Holy Orders) to one episcopal office, which is hard to map onto an Eastern framework.

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 510
R
Member
Member
R Offline
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 510
Originally Posted by Epiphanius
Thanks to you and to all the people who make "The Byzantine Forum" possible! biggrin


Peace,
Deacon Richard

Hear, hear!!

or is it
"Here, here!!"

anyways .. Amen.

-ray


Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 396
J
Member
Member
J Offline
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 396
Richard, Father Alexander was one of my favorite people in the OCA. If indeed he was right that unity comes from on high, it makes no difference whether or not we act in favor of it or oppose it because it will happens when God wants it to and not before.

Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 490
Likes: 1
G
Member
Member
G Offline
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 490
Likes: 1
Quote
We do not have to "profess faith in the Church Fathers" in order to see that, say, Aquinas' views on the problem of evil and predestination (God does not will the eternal salvation of all) are incompatible with the Eastern Christian doctrines of man and salvation.

I don't want this to go off-topic, but I think it's worth pointing out (so that a straw-man doesn't develop or get preserved) that Aquinas says the opposite. He just clarifies that we can speak of general willing and contingent willing. God wills that everyone has eternal life, but wills it contingently; if He willed it absolutely then it would be impossible for us to NOT have eternal life, which we know is false.

Now back to your scheduled discussion! wink

Peace and God bless!

Last edited by Ghosty; 12/12/07 06:41 PM.
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 118
Member
Member
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 118
Ghosty,

I started a new thread on the topic.

Page 5 of 5 1 2 3 4 5

Moderated by  Irish Melkite 

Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2024 (Forum 1998-2024). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 8.0.0