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Dec 29th, 2019
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I had a professor that described Polish as, "trying to listen to Elmer Fudd". Than you had a very rude professor.
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In fact, Poles have a quite different national/cultural development from the East Slavs and are, with the Czechs, the most "Westward" oriented Slavs.
There was even an academic movement in Poland to disavow ANY Slavic connection with Poland whatsoever and redefine Polish culture in central European terms alone.
Serdechnie Dzienkuje,
Alex
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Yea...he was kind of brash. I think he was there when Pitt was founded in 1787...
He didn't have a pretty great attitude toward Rusyns as well.
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Jessup B.C. Deacon Member
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Jessup B.C. Deacon Member
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Recently I was at a event and a man showed me his doctoral thesis on how Slovakians, Western Ukrainians and Rusyns are really Polish.
He went back centuries into history and he found that linguistically, sociologically and all the various forms of Literature and art existing in Slovakia and Western Ukraine today are from the Poles. Over time, the Polish language split into dialects that we call Rusyn, Slovakian, Ukrainian, but none-the-less, they are all Polish in origin. So he said that Poland should regain the land that is now Slovakia, Western Ukraine, and perhaps a part of Romania. You should have seen the way he traced all the various cultural aspects of the Slovaks, Ukrainians and Rusyns back to Polish origin. Even the various burial customs point back to Polish origin. He also said in his thesis that once Poland regains these lands they will become the equivalents to states or provinces and what he calls "Polish dialects" will be re-written back into the Polish alphabet and only allow for certain government approved words and phrases to allow a sense of "One Poland, many people." The unified language with regional gov't approved variances he claims will help the new Poland meld into the European Union and build strength throughout Europe. Just out of curiosity, let me guess at his own nationality. Ukrainian, right? 
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Jessup B.C. Deacon Member
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This also reminds me of a story told to me by the late Prof. John Kahanick, who had been choir director of the BC Cathedral in Passaic. He explained that he had always considered himself to be of a "Pan-Slav" leaning. He went on to say that when Karol Wojtyla was elevated to the Papacy, he attended a Polish-American dinner function. He was invited to make some remarks. He went on to say to the assembled crowd: "I think it is a great blessing from God that a Slav has been elevated to the Papacy". He said that, at that point, a female voice was heard, from the back of the room, which said, in a rather irritated fashion: "HE IS NOT A SLAV, HE IS POLISH"!
Enough said.
Dn. Robert
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Orthodox domilsean Member
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I always knew I was right in saying pierogi! What the heck is a pyrohy anyhow?
Wait, I thought I read somewhere that the Rusyns were actually a Celtic people... wasn't there a bunch of monks trying to prove that in Slovakia or something not too long ago?
Well, what does it matter to me. I'm Polish, Rusyn, and Irish, so I've got the best of them all! Is Rusyn me, nach bhfuil, an t-athar Serge?
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Jessup B.C. Deacon Member
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Jessup B.C. Deacon Member
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I always knew I was right in saying pierogi! What the heck is a pyrohy anyhow?
Wait, I thought I read somewhere that the Rusyns were actually a Celtic people... wasn't there a bunch of monks trying to prove that in Slovakia or something not too long ago?
Well, what does it matter to me. I'm Polish, Rusyn, and Irish, so I've got the best of them all! Is Rusyn me, nach bhfuil, an t-athar Serge? Not too long ago, I read an opinion by someone (don't remember who) which put forth the idea that all Eastern Slavs would have done well to have appropriated the term "Rusyn", because, literally, it means "Son of Rus", Rus being the ancestral tribal patriarch. It would be appropriate, at the very least, for Great Russians, Ukrainians, and Carpatho-Rusyns. The term "Ukraine" actually means something like "borderland". I have a friend who is a UGCC priest, but he is not of Ukrainian ancestry. Once, when he had a bad day at a parish meeting, he said "I can't stand these "borderites"! 
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To complicate matters, the late Pope John Paul II whose mother was a Rusyn Greek Catholic emigrated to Krakow from a small town in Galicia / Halychyna during the WW1 era. During a visit to Harvard University the Pope commented that today, his mother's ethnicity would be considered Ukrainian.
By the Way, the "bad day at the UGCC parish meeting" may in fact have been with the 'Banderites' and not 'borderites'.
I.F.
Last edited by Jean Francois; 01/16/08 06:37 PM.
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Well, after WW1 Jozef Pilsudski wanted to create a Polish Commonwealth that would include Ukraine,Ruthenia and Lithuania, with parts of what was the new country of Czechoslovakia to come at a later date. His main rival for the presidency of Poland, Roman Dmowski was vehemently opposed to the idea because he believed that Ukrainians, Ruthenians and Lithuanians were not Poles ! Here in the USA a number of rallies and meetings were held in support of the Commonwealth idea, and several of them were violently disrupted. It wasen't the Ukrainians or Ruthenians doing it though, it was Lithuanian nationalists. In fact the situation in Chicago got so bad that after a brawl at St Adalbert's auditorium in Pilsen and another in Bridgeport, foremen at the Union Stockyards had to segregate Polish and Lithuanian workers because of continual fights breaking out.And for years afterward, West of Morgan St in the Bridgeport area was a no-go area for Lithuanians, and East of Morgan St was a no-go area for Poles. Still I know more than a few Poles who call Vilnius "Wilno" and L'viv "Lwow".
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Forum Keilbasa Sleuth Member
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This thesis is being defended at the University of Pittsburgh in case anyone is curious. It is very thourough and may have significant implications on the future boundourial geography of modern Europe.
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This thesis is being defended at the University of Pittsburgh in case anyone is curious. It is very thourough and may have significant implications on the future boundourial geography of modern Europe. Христос Родився! Славіти Його! Nothing personal, but every graduate student feels that his research will change the world. I think the desire of people in former communist lands to have their country join the EU is of greater significance to them because of their economic needs at the moment, than a thesis written in English in the USA.
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Although the Ukrainian and Polish peoples are two distinct Slavic group (East and West) for a long time, the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth included much of what is today the modern Ukrainian Republic. The Polish aristocracy ruled with an iron fist and the peasant Ruthenians and Poles lived in relative harmony. The Renaissance arrived in Ukraine via this Commonwealth and with it many positive cultural developments, including some which had been adopted by the Poles. Slovakia and Carpatho-Rus were never part of the the Polish Empire, so I'm not sure on what basis the Polish author is making his claim that these regions were historicaly ethnographicaly Polish. You may want to look at this map of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth to get a better picture of just how vast the lands were: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/de/Irp1635.png
Last edited by Jean Francois; 01/16/08 07:42 PM.
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An bhfuil tu Rusyn? Nil fhios agam!
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Two comments:
a) people have, within reason, a right to the ethnic identity they prefer; and
b) the correct adjectival form of Slovakia, as well as the noun designating the language of that country is SLOVAK , not "Slovakian".
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An bhfuil tu Rusyn? Nil fhios agam! You said that better than I!
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