www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Everybody Loves Raymond

It seems it was not evident for Carole and she offered her viewpoint which I can appreciate. Alex and the dictionary give another viewpoint which is common and documented and therefore, I would hope, acceptable. I had presumed "guys" could be understood as inclusive and am pleased now to be properly informed that it indeed, per dictionary, is.

Regarding issues with the RDL, for instance man-men, current dictionaries and recent past common usage also indicate that it, too, certainly can be understood as inclusive and therefore, I would hope, acceptable. Besides, man-men is a loaded term theologically which guy-guys is not; consequently, fidelity to the revealed truth being professed must be of primary concern, and I would expect that it (man-men) be given even greater deference regarding inclusivity. That is, we do not find

for us guys and for our salvation ... He became Guy

but do find in the Greek and Slavonic -- and should want to understand and experience also in the English -- of the Creed the profound truth that

for us men and for our salvation ... He became Man.

Dn. Anthony

I watch that show and see that they were from two different worlds; upper-class, privileged society and mainstream society.

You must not have seen the episode in which Ray loses Debra's diamond when he's trying to replace it with a better quality stone and finds out that she had replaced the pathetic stone he had originally given her with something of much higher quality.

If everyone on the forum had valid opinions everyone would agree with me on everything. Not much point in having a forum then, though I guess.

I was at a New Year's get togather with a regular guest star from the show, but had no idea who she was, because I've never seen a single episode. She was nice looking though.

I wasn't offended. Nor did I say that I was. You read far too much into one simple comment. There was no need, whatever, for anyone to apologize for the use of "guys." It is not offensive to me. Nor did I say that it was. I am aware that it is inclusive of both sexes in common usage.

Though I do tend to think that women and men have different opinions on what makes something funny. Particularly in family/marriage related sitcoms. Thus I clarified that the opinion I was giving was from the woman's perspective.

Dear Nan,

I've seen that episode several times - very funny and telling!

Alex