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#27423 11/29/03 11:26 AM
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I recently came across the following news report from ZENIT:

Chaldean Synod Called to Rome to Elect New Patriarch

VATICAN CITY, OCT. 29, 2003 (Zenit.org).- John Paul II called the Synod of the Bishops of the Chaldean Church to meet Dec. 2-3 in the Vatican to elect the new patriarch of Babylon of the Chaldeans.

The Pope's decision came in virtue of Canon 72 of the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches, explained Vatican press office director Joaqu�n Navarro-Valls. The patriarchal see of the Chaldean Church is in Baghdad, Iraq.

The 22 bishops of the synod met in August to appoint the successor of Patriarch Raphael Bidawid, who died July 7. Such a process followed the custom of the Easternpatriarchal churches.

Canon 72 provides for the election by a two-thirds vote in the first ballot or by an absolute majority after a certain number of votes. If the election does not take place in the first 15 days from the opening of the synod, Paragraph 2 of the canon establishes that the case goes to the Roman Pontiff.

Christians in Iraq number 800,000, about 3% of the population. Of these, Chaldean Catholics constitute over 70%. The Baghdad community has about 350,000 faithful.

The official language of the Chaldean liturgy is Aramaic. As the faithful normally speak Arabic, the celebration of the liturgy is bilingual. There are Chaldean communities in America, Europe and Oceania.



His Beatitude Patriarch Bidawid (Memory Eternal) was a great leader to his flock in Iraq, as well as to those in the diaspora. He also helped strengthen ties to the Assyrian Church of the East. My question is; does anyone know who will be enthroned as the new Patriarch of Babylon?Patriarch Bidawid along with His Holiness Mar Dinkha IV of the Assyrian Church developed close and cordial relations between their two respective churches. Does anyone know what is the current status of Assyrian-Chaldean relations? My hope is that they remain amicable and grow closer in the future.

ProCatholico


Glory be to God
#27424 11/29/03 01:20 PM
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You know, some things in the Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches are plain old weird. Case in point:

"Canon 72 provides for the election by a two-thirds vote in the first ballot or by an absolute majority after a certain number of votes. If the election does not take place in the first 15 days from the opening of the synod, Paragraph 2 of the canon establishes that the case goes to the Roman Pontiff."

Why? I could understand having the Pope make the decision if the synod couldn't elect someone in 3 months. But as the canon law is written, the synod only has 15 days or else the Roman Curia (acting in the name of the Pope) gets to appoint the patriarch. It can take longer than that to elect a Pope!

Moreover, the Vatican's Congregation for the Eastern Churches almost never chooses a new bishop for anyone in 15 days or less. Heck, it took almost 3 years for them to select a bishop for the Ukrainian Eparchy of Chicago. Yet a patriarchal synod has only 15 days to make a pick!

Does this strike anyone else as unjust?

At least it appears that the Holy Father is going to still allow the synod to elect the new patriarch.

Anthony

#27425 11/29/03 01:58 PM
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Shlomo Anthony,
Yes I find Canon 72 very unfair. But as you know I find it unfair that the West can have a world-wide Patriarchate, but we are limited to our "ancient" territories.

Many Maronites are still mad about the Pope appointing our Patriarch during the Lebanese Civil War era, since our Eparchs could not be trusted (according to the colonial office, I mean the Congregation For Eastern Churches).

Poosh BaShlomo,
Yuhannon

#27426 11/29/03 03:45 PM
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Quote
Originally posted by Dragani:

At least it appears that the Holy Father is going to still allow the synod to elect the new patriarch.

Anthony [/QB]
I think this is an important point.....this Pope seems to be making every effort to make things work out for people, even when "technically" he doesn't have to do so. God bless him, and grant him health and strength.

Rather than focusing on what may or may not have been unfair in the past, let's look at how many things this Pope is working on working out....


Let us pray for Unity In Christ!
#27427 11/29/03 04:36 PM
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Quote
Originally posted by Dragani:
"Canon 72 provides for the election by a two-thirds vote in the first ballot or by an absolute majority after a certain number of votes. If the election does not take place in the first 15 days from the opening of the synod, Paragraph 2 of the canon establishes that the case goes to the Roman Pontiff."

Why? I could understand having the Pope make the decision if the synod couldn't elect someone in 3 months. But as the canon law is written, the synod only has 15 days or else the Roman Curia (acting in the name of the Pope) gets to appoint the patriarch. It can take longer than that to elect a Pope!

Moreover, the Vatican's Congregation for the Eastern Churches almost never chooses a new bishop for anyone in 15 days or less. Heck, it took almost 3 years for them to select a bishop for the Ukrainian Eparchy of Chicago. Yet a patriarchal synod has only 15 days to make a pick!

Does this strike anyone else as unjust?
Anthony,

In perhaps one of my few instances of not finding disagreement with the way that Rome deals with the Eastern Churches, I have to say that I find some rationale in Canon 72. You are correct, it can and has, though not recently, taken extraordinary periods for the election of a Pope and therein lie some of the papacy's great horror stories.

None of our Synods are so large in number that it shouldn't be expected that things might happen sooner than might be expected from the College of Cardinals. That doesn't change the fact that there are no excuses for the unreasonable delay on Rome's part in regard to Chicago.

In this instance, the rationale for the time period imposed by Canon 72 aside, I think there is a particular urgency involved to achieving resolution. The situation in Iraq, which is the traditional homeland of the Chaldean Church, is such that leadership is urgently needed.

Couple that with the fact that there are very distinct hierarchical parties within that Church - what are being referred to as the Syriac (or Aramaic) Rite and Arabic Rite parties, seemingly what historically have been sometimes termed the Papal and Dominican factions - and the situation needs resolution, which perhaps can only be readily achieved by impressing the Pope's concern on the Synod.

Of particular concern to many is that Mar Antoine Audo, considered a major contender for the Patriarchate, is of the Arabic faction. That group is inclined to the "arabization" of the Church, critical to prosletyization, but feared as a factor that will diminish the Church's mission to its traditional base of faithful. Mar Audo was raised in Syria, does not speak Syriac, and serves the Liturgy only in Arabic, not Aramaic. He is said to be very Latin in his spirituality and it is felt that, were he elected, it would represent a significant blow to the very fruitful dialogue and excellent relations between the Chaldeans and their counterparts of the Assyrian Churches. There are a couple of strong candidates from the other faction, but reports are that there is an almost equal division of strength between the two groups.

An excellent source for following news in the Assyrian communities, Catholic and otherwise, is Zinda Magazine [zindamagazine.com]

I agree with Unity's comment. Give credit where due.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
#27428 11/29/03 07:34 PM
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A Chaldean Patriarch who cannot speak Syro-Aramaic (or Sureth, presumably) and only wants to serve in Arabic? What a nutty idea. But who elected this man to the episcopate? Incognitus

#27429 11/29/03 10:18 PM
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Incognitus,

He is the child of Chaldean parents, but was raised in Syria. Apparently, he is not unique among the clergy outside of Iraq - although I don't know that there are any others in the episcopal ranks who lack the ability to serve the Liturgy in the liturgical language of the Church. Those whom I referred to above as the "Dominican faction" strongly promote arabinization of the Liturgy.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
#27430 11/30/03 10:20 AM
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Quote
Originally posted by incognitus:
A Chaldean Patriarch who cannot speak Syro-Aramaic (or Sureth, presumably) and only wants to serve in Arabic? What a nutty idea. But who elected this man to the episcopate? Incognitus
Incognitus,

Good morning. Antoine Audo, a Jesuit, was elected Bishop of Alep by the Chaldean Patriarchal Synod on January 18, 1992.

Interestingly, 9 of the 22 members of the current Synod took part in the 1992 election of Bishop Audo to the Eparchy of Alep.

Peace,

Charles

#27431 11/30/03 05:29 PM
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I am neither Assyrian or Chaldean but I am some kind of familiar with the situation of both Churches.

Next weeks will be important for the Chaldean Church, because they will elect a Patriarch and this will be of particular interest of Eastern Christians and particularly those in Communion with Rome.

Unfortunately, the current presence of western troops in Iraq and the liberalization that its society will be living, will probably be used by some elements in Rome to impose their political agenda over the Chaldean faithful.

The Vatican is now pushing for the appointment of Mar Audo, Bishop of Aleppo as Patriarch. He is very close to the Baathist Syrian state and sees himself as an Arab Christian. He does not speak the Assyrian language or has links with his own nation. He did most of his priestly and theological studies in the West with modernist theologians.

His programmed reforms include the translation of the Assyrian Liturgy to modern-vernacular Arabic (he does not celebrate in Assyrian in Syria) and as you know, some of the abuses in the West started with the translation of the liturgy to vulgar tongues and subtle changes in the meaning of the words.

This is accompanied by the attemps by the new liberal disidents who will arrive as Iraq government, and the current Baath administration in Syria to make their countries "more Western" and it's not surprising that they will try to make Eastern Christians to look more and more like modern Western catholics.

#27432 12/01/03 10:59 AM
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Dear Anthony,

At least the Chaldeans will be able to work on electing a Patriarch in all that time on a full stomach, and unlike what happens in a papal conclave . . . wink

Alex

#27433 12/01/03 11:37 AM
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Originally posted by Mexican:
The Vatican is now pushing for the appointment of Mar Audo, Bishop of Aleppo as Patriarch.
Mexican,

I'm not sure that I agree. Your description of Mar Audo's practice of his faith vis-a-vis use of Arabic in the Liturgy and his leanings is accurate from all that I know and read of him. However, those tendencies - toward arabinization (strange that, in this context, it equals westernization) - have been hallmarks of the so-called 'Dominican' faction, as opposed to what has been termed the 'Papal' faction.

Unless there has been a major shift in thinking among the latter, I wouldn't see those as supportive of Mar Audo. And, at least generally, the latter are seen as more in line with the thinking of Rome.

By the way, the most recently elected Chaldean bishop is a strong supporter of Mar Audo and of the concept of arabinization.

An interesting read on the topic is at:
Chaldean Patriarchal Election: A Crisis of Leadership [zindamagazine.com]

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
#27434 12/01/03 12:54 PM
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Dear Neil and Mexicano,

Yes, ultimately I don't think the issue of Latinization with respect to a perceived control of affairs by the Vatican is as tragically perceived by the Chaldeans as it is among other EC Churches.

The Assyrians are on famous terms with the Vatican and with their Chaldean brethren and in a way that does not obtain among any other Eastern Church (save for the Maronites perhaps).

I think the Assyrian/Chaldean Churches see in Rome a strong Western ally in which to find some solid protection for their patrimony - and I think they are right.

Alex

#27435 12/01/03 01:03 PM
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Quote
Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic:
Yes, ultimately I don't think the issue of Latinization with respect to a perceived control of affairs by the Vatican is as tragically perceived by the Chaldeans as it is among other EC Churches.

The Assyrians are on famous terms with the Vatican and with their Chaldean brethren ...
Alex,

Very true. The election of Mar Audo would risk all of this, which is why I doubt the theory that the Vatican would be supportive of his candidacy.

Many years,

Neil


"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
#27436 12/01/03 01:10 PM
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Dear Neil,

You see - some things I say are true! smile

How do you say "Many Years" in Gaelic?

Alex

#27437 12/04/03 01:12 PM
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There seems to be some confusion over the name taken by the newly elected Patriarch. While several news reports yesterday listed him as Patriarch Karim III, all of the official Vatican documents/letters released today list him as Patriarch Emmanuel III.

Any idea why the disparity? (and which is right?)

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