www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Going towards the right after leaving towards the left

Yup. Respect the integrity of each rite.

Question:

Can't an Eastern Catholic attend a Latin Church with no problem as a visitor? I mean, if the issue of time is a temproary one (and for good reasons, not just that one hate's getting up early on Sunday morning lol), even if temporary means "this whole school year", can't one just go to a Latin Church for time being but always consider the Eastern Church their default (that is, when things are back to normal, that's where we go)? I mean, I could see changing churches if you felt you would be better spiritually nourrished in a Latin tradition, but if it is simply a logistical quandry, then I don't undertand transferring.

For example, my friend has a temporary job in Detroit so he goes to an Antiochian Parish. But, he has no plans on that being his permanent situation. So, until he does have one, he considers his parish here (taht I go to) his home parish and goes to our priest for confession whenever possible. And that's not even changing rites. that's just a problem of distance.

I for one could not see transferring Churches (even if the rite is the same) for matters of temporary convenience.

Just a thought that I think others have shared here. But I don't know the entire story of the OP.

Xpy

Xpy,

There is absolutely no problem with an EC attending an RC [ Latin] Church if for some reason they are not able to get to an EC one [ whether it's UGCC , Ruthenian , Melkite or whatever ].

Vice versa - if a Latin catholic is in an area where there are no Latin Churches but Eastern catholic ones are there - then he attends an EC one .

In my particular circumstances at present my chances of getting to my own parish [ only about 40 miles away mind you ] are not great - but I will go Latin from time to time - other times I will just stay home and do as my SF wishes me to do - Prayers etc.

Gotcha, by the way:

What is the most accepted and least offensive way for other to refer to what I was calling "Latin Catholic/Rite"?

I remember from other experiences in other forums some were offended by latin (because they would say "But I'm not latin, I'm american:) or if I would say Roman they would either say "I'm not Roman, I am American or English" OR go the other way and say "All Catholics, Eastern or Western, are Roman in that we are under/with the Pope of Rome". So, I feel like I always lose. Is there a commonly accepted way to refer to the "Latin Catholics" here in Byzcath?

Thanks.

Xpy

Politely ?

I am very friendy with a young RC Priest over here - I looked after him through 6 years of Secondary School , 1 year of University here and then suppoerted him through 7 years of Seminary in the Pontifical Scots College in Rome - yes it's relevant .

The Priests coming out of the Scots College in Rome are always referred to as Romans , those coming from the Real Collegio in Salamanca are referred to as Spaniards - and they are all Scots boys and Catholic

As long as you are polite - I think most of us will understand what you mean

Thanks

I just didn't know if there was a "common" or more "correct" way.

I suppose I prefer Latin Since all Catholics are technically "Roman" even if not in rite. i would say Western Rite, but then WR is usually what is used to refer to WR Orthodox as opposed to ER.

So complicated! lol

XPy

I would see it more along the lines of Patrimony.
The West is Latin, because your parent Church was Rome, or you are Ambrosian or Mozarabic. Those whose parent Church was Costatntinolpe are Byzantins. That my opinion.
Stephanos I

Okay, so I said to someone else in a PM that I will just go with Latin Rite Catholic (or LRC) and Eastern Rite Catholic (or ERC) since there are tons of rites on that side and I'm not good at distinguishing.

It sounds like, however, people don't try to get up in arms about petty things like labels. Like, I don't care if someone calls me Greek Orthodox even though my Church is Russian. I get what they mean... and I like Greeks anyway lol if i correct them it would only be for clarification in case it did matter for some reason.

Xpy

Oops, I just noticed I totally hi-jacked this thread. Sorry to the OP. that was probably why peopler were sending me messages so as to keep this thread on track.

Well, to the OP, I guess I have nothing further to say other than God's peace be with you!

Xpy

Amazing, isn't it?

That 3 sisters can't be quite right, though. I know two attached to Holy Family, and I believe that there are at least three attached to one of the schools. I don't believe that I've even *heard* of the brothers before, though.

Add to that a BC priest working half-time for one of the large RC parishes, who also has our parish and the bi-rite mission up on Mt. Charleston[1], a Greco-Italo-Albanian priest and parish, a deacon shared by the BC and GIAC (? :)) parishes, and a retired BC priest who helps out at our parish and the mission (though mostly he takes care of his mother)[2], and a religious brother on loan to our parish for fundraising and the like. Oh, and a Maronite group with a Sunday afternoon liturgy at St. Anne's.

Hmm, the shrine at the south end of the strip may be in addition to the listed parishes. I wonder if the chaplain at the catholic high school is counted (a Viatorian out of an eastern mother house; they used to run the school, but were pulled a few years ago, leaving just the one ) . . .

There is also an "american byzantine catholic" shrine listed, but I've never hear of them.

Still, if all the easterns from these parishes showed up together, there's Masses at which noone would notice the influx . . . but often, our little church has both BC priests concelebrating . . .

[1] They'll be adding a tridentine liturgy once our BC priest is fully trained for it! The GAI priest has also offered to do so.
[2] He actually changed rites from RC after retirement. Previously, he had been pastor of our parish as a bi-ritual priest.



It went from a cardinal noticing that NV was the only state without its own bishop, to the Diocese of Reno, to elevating a shrine here to a co-cathedral, renaming the diocese to Reno-Las Vegas, to the diocese of Las Vegas.

The shrine was initially built on land donated by casinos and with casino money. The casinos asked for a very early (4 A.M.?) Sunday mass for workers coming off shift.

I think the diocese is reaching the end of year 12; I was at the 10 year celebration as a fifth grade teacher for the year. I never thought I'd see a Mass in a casino, let alone being concelebrated by two bishops! (The Stations Casinos [and the family that owns them] are major and regular supporters of the church and catholic education])


Yep As of a couple of years ago, all new parishes are to be built with schools, too.

hawk

Simple Sinner and Others,

Yes, I've always been instructed on this Forum to cross the Byzantine way when visiting a Byzantine church, but that was years ago. I assumed it was still en vogue, if you will, but obviously personalities on this Forum have changed over the years and, I suppose, have the suggestions about what to do when visiting a Byzantine parish.

I always cross myself from right-to-left when at a Byzantine temple, though I feel slightly more comfortable doing left-to-right (feels more natural to me; did even before I was Catholic).

Alexis

Alexis, just do what you wish on this matter... You don't HAVE to do it either way in either circumstance.

I attend "lunch hour low" (the 12:05pm 'lunch hour' Mass at the Cathedral a block from where I worked) from time to time. I honestly don't think anyone has EVER noticed how I cross myself. I also think that if I had to think about it too much, I would be pretty distracted.

Hello all, I have noticed aside from the right to left v. left to right direction of the hand during "and of the Holy Spirit" part of the making of the sign of the cross, during attendance of a Melkite D.L. people seemed to end the gesture by striking the chest like the "mea culpa" gesture, does anyone know if this is what is happening, and further, what are the various little ways or varitions of making the sign of the cross among you all, and if there is some little addition, what is your spiritual tradition? I always used to end it with a kiss, but I am curious!

I think Pope Innocent II was the only Pope to designate how one is to sign oneself--that is from the right to left shoulders.
My wife, who is Roman, thinks I make the sign of the cross wrong when I go to mass with her! The Latins did not universally start making the sign of the cross from left to right until sometime in the 13th or 14th centuries, to counteract the Orthodox way (according to some Eatern monks I talked to).

Slava Isusu Khrestu

I believe that it all started in Spain ( 13-14 centuries???) with one of the Kings who mistakenly went from left to right. Naturally, no one dare correct him so, the population joined him and now you know "the rest of the story.


Z Bohom
Kolya