www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Parish Life & Evangelization Mission-oriented vs Ethnic Churches

I just got back from work. I'm thinking of moving, possibly back to the Pittsburgh area.

In any case, I have a question for everyone: I'm a two-step convert. I was raised Roman Catholic, became involved with the Ruthenian Catholic Church for about two years, and then entered into Holy Orthodoxy just recently through ACROD. I've been to many Ruthenian churches (mostly ethnic) but only one ACROD church (the one into which I converted, and which is mission and much less ethnic-based). I'm wondering from other people: what are your experiences with ethnic churches in comparison with mission-based churches? Where do you feel more familiar?

For some reason, while I am not unhappy with the mission parish I attend, I feel as though I better belong in an ethnic parish--even though the people may not be as openly friendly. A lot of the people at my parish complain about how they were treated at ethnic churches, but in my experience, I've never been ill-treated in an ethnic parish. In fact, when I went to an OCA parish, several people gave me phosphora bread, and one woman even put her hand on my shoulder and said "Thank you for coming. Please come again." I'm like half Slovak/Hungarian, so maybe this is why I like ethnic parishes. Who knows.

I have experienced both types of parish - mission and ethnic. I find that my "Carpatho-Rusyn soul" feels most at home with our people. It's very deep and has to do with sharing the same roots.

Ive never attended an orthodox Mass, I'm afraid. But I interject to say welcome to the forum.

Don't be afraid! We don't bite!

You have truly missed out on a fine slice of Heaven on Earth!!!

"...churches (mostly ethnic) but only one ACROD church (the one into which I converted, and which is mission..."

[/quote]ZWombatZ

OK, a novice at some yerms. What is a ACROD church and is the title self explanatory? How does a mission parish differ from an ethnic one; size, history, mortgage? No offence I really do not understand.

American Carpatho-Russian (Rusyn) Orthodox Greek Catholic Diocese of the U.S.A,

www.acrod.org [acrod.org]

Ung

You could probably draw up a list of positives and minuses of both environments (I have in my own head). The best is if you can find a way to combine both; the zeal and commitment of missions with the established traditions and wisdom of a long standing Orthodox community. It's easier said than done. Both taken on their own can have their excesses and down sides.

I first came in to contact with Orthodoxy with a couple of OCA parishes that were of the older ethnic variety in the Midwest. They used English, had a mix of converts and cradle Orthodox, still fostered certain customs and did things like ethnic food and craft sales. I spent a few years in an Antiochian mission that was probably about 85% convert, including the priest. I have been a member of an established ACROD parish for about two years. There were a few reasons why I made the move.

My parish now is much more similar in atmosphere to the OCA parishes I had visited earlier; so it was something I was looking for again. The majority of members were raised in the parish, there are some people of various other Orthodox backgrounds, some people who married in, and the one or two oddballs like myself who are straight out converts. Just about everything is in English, a little Slavonic, and there's only one guy I can think of who you would consider a recent immigrant and he's Lebanese; so our parish is definitely not looking to the old world for its identity.

You certainly can't mistake the background of the parish, and we do food sales and other Rusyn things like the Fashangy this weekend, but I don't feel like as an outsider that I can't fit in rather easily. I could see how some people would feel like it wasn't their culture though, and to some people any Orthodox Church is always going to feel "ethnic". I think some people tend to affix the ethnic label to parishes that don't welcome outsiders, and there are parishes like that as I've heard. I've always felt welcome in the "ethnic" parishes though, so it's not my experience.

In the long term, I do think the older more ethnically oriented parishes of the Upper Midwest and Northeast are really going to struggle. The future of the church is probably more along the lines of the mission type environments as they grow in to full parishes.

I would say that, despite best efforts, in an ethno-centric parish, someone who simply identifies themselves as "American" will be treated as a second class citizen.

It does not always manifest itself up front, but if the percentage of "American"s surpasses the resident ethnic group, the contest begins.

Also, if money is involved in, say, mission, outreach, evangelism - these things are entirely tertiary to most ethnic parishes, and primary to Americans.

And the bishops are not only not much help, they are a huge part of the problem, as they don't seem to understand how one can be American in society AND in Church.

At least, that has been the consistent experience of my family, and many, many of my friends, many of whom are convert clergy.

Call me naive but help me out here. Is not �American� a common denominator we all share? We can�t be talking football verses soccer sports so give some examples. Are we talking using ham or lamb for Easter? At the food festival is it spelling dumpling as pyrohy or pierogies or even vareneky? Are we saying keeping a pace singing services or allowing it to drag out? I�m sorry it might be me being a novice to your forum, or living in a metropolitan area that presupposes everyone has unique differences. I acknowledge there is a problem but what is it beyond labels?

I myself am perplexed by this issue. I believe it is a good thing to remember our Church's origins and traditions, but need to be open toward evangelization of peoples.

It's a catch 22. Preserving the ethnic traditions versus being "American". We've battled this out in my parish and finally reached a compromise.

Slavonic twice a month, (which is only 1/4 of the liturgy), English otherwise. I'd like an all Slavonic liturgy once in a while, but it remains a pipe dream.

There must be more to it than language?

i honestly love the idea of a mission-oriented parish. There is much potential for the Christian East to grow and become the next global face of Christianity.

the idea of ethnocentric (at the possible cost of being Christocentric)parishes is day by day becoming more and more laughable. if Orthodoxy and Eastern Catholicism wish to survive and expand in the Sunbelt, ethnicism will have to sit far in the back of the bus. the OCA parish in Chattanooga, for example, is overwhelmingly non Russian. may be ethnic parishes work up North, but then, the North is shrinking and the South is growing in population. ethnicism doesn't mean a !@#$%^ thing down here. oh, back to the OCA parish: the reason why there is one in Chattanooga at all is because some loudmouths at the Greek parish didn't want non Greeks (barabarians!)in their midst. thus, those wishing to convert to Orthodoxy searched about and conveniently came across St. Anne's OCA in Knoxville (which had a NON RUSSIAN former Episcopalian pastor). they in turn sent a mission team to Chattanooga, and VOILA! an OCA mission parish. time to get over it, folks. JESUS, and not ethnicity, is the only way to the Father.
Much Love,
Jonn