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Serge a "Catholic Basher." That's just plain ironic. If you were to look at his most excelent site, you would notice that the only thing he is against within Catholicism is the growing attempt to protestantize the Latin Rite. Serge every word you said was true. I wouldn't change a word of it.
Joe Zollars
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Alex,
So true. In fact I'm in discussions with some Methodists who are looking at the possibility, some time down the road, of trying to create a Methodist Order within the Catholic Church. These people are presently Methodist but see little hope that the Apostolic way will become the standard within the United Methodist Church. They, however, love many of the Methodist ways and do not wish to abandon them.
Dan Lauffer
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Dear Kurt, But the Vatican can and will take notice of us and our suggestions! I wrote to the Vatican some time ago re: the Papal visit to Ukraine and received a response! I don't mind telling you that a teeny-weeny bit of what I wrote was actually used by one of the Pope's speech-writers in His HOliness' sermons in Ukraine. Something I can tell my grandchildren once I get around to producing children. ![[Linked Image]](https://www.byzcath.org/bboard/smile.gif) What can I say, my wife tells me her hand hurts . . . Alex Originally posted by Kurt K:
Serge, snookums,
You suggest a certain practice currently being engaged in by the highest authorities of Catholic Church is a waste of time. I don't know why you think my noting that is an accusation of Catholic bashing. You are free to make your observations as to how the Catholic Church could more effectively use its time with no offense from this Catholic, though also no guarantee that your advise will be taken.
K.
[This message has been edited by Orthodox Catholic (edited 07-25-2001).]
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Dear Dan, How exciting! I know of the existence of a Methodist religious Order (St Luke?). There is so much of the Methodist patrimony that would fit in nicely with the Catholic liturgy and other practices. Ah, to practice Christianity the way the Wesleys, John Fletcher, Francis Asbury and so many others did and within the Catholic Church! What renewal! What blessing! And my favourite book on the Rosary is that written by the Methodist, the Rev. Neville Ward, "Five for sorrow, ten for joy." Blessings to you and your friends in this project! Godspeed to you and don't forget to share your rich spiritual traditions with us! Alex Originally posted by CD Lauffer:
Alex,
So true. In fact I'm in discussions with some Methodists who are looking at the possibility, some time down the road, of trying to create a Methodist Order within the Catholic Church. These people are presently Methodist but see little hope that the Apostolic way will become the standard within the United Methodist Church. They, however, love many of the Methodist ways and do not wish to abandon them.
Dan Lauffer
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JMJ A simple suggestion. Have them petition the vatican. This is what a group of High Church Anglicans did and now we have the Anglican Use Liturgy, which will probably one day become a seperate rite within the church when it gets big enough. Have them go to www.atonementonline.com. [ atonementonline.com.] I certainly hope that they do come into full union with the church. Like I said, petition Rome. Joe Zollars
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Dear Kurt,
But the Vatican can and will take notice of us and our suggestions! Oh, Alex, I did not mean to imply that the Holy See would or should ignore every helpful suggestion offered by a member of the laity. I just think it is very clear that their is no liklihood that the Holy See will cease their warm and affirmative relationship with the World Council of Churches. In fact, the Holy See seems to be moving in the opposite direction and having more interaction nowdays, even though we are not full members as the Orthodox are. K.
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Dear Kurt, I didn't mean to imply otherwise! I agree with you! My point in raising that item about my communication with the Vatican was purely selfish, vainglorious, and egotistical. And I agree with what our Holy Father says and does in this and other matters, to be perfectly Frank . I love it when you express affection in your posts! Alex
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Originally posted by CD Lauffer:
[b]Dear John,
If you witness the Gospel by refering to our Protestant brothers and sisters as "wacky" please do not bother to post here again.
Administrator
A bit touchy aren't you. I was a Protestant virtually all of my life. It is a bit of an unusual world. If it had not been a little "wacky" I would not have converted.
Dan Lauffer
[This message has been edited by CD Lauffer (edited 07-23-2001).][/B] Dan, I sympathize with you! I was one of those protestant lutherans. Enough said. Fr Stephanos
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Originally posted by Kurt K:
I believe that Anglophones overemphasize the distinction between the terms. French Lutherans do call their clergy by the same term as do Catholics. In Swedish, all clergy are called priester (priest) including the Baptists.
BTW, the Lutherans don't have high and low church parites. They tend to be consistant in their style. Interestingly, unlike the Episcopalians who wear the stole and the, if high church, the chasuable over it, Lutherans pastors regularly use the chasuable but object to wearing a stole under the chasuable. They hold an outward garment is "evangelical" -- it makes a statement consistent with the Gospel. While a non-visable garment is "ritualistic".
Danish Lutherans have weekly Mass (their term) and objected to an attempt to introduce Morning Prayer as "Catholic" i.e. a monastic office rather than a good evangelical communion.
K.
[This message has been edited by Kurt K (edited 07-23-2001).] BTW Kurt the Lutheran Church most certainly does have evangelical and High Church parties. Check into it! Fr Stephanos [This message has been edited by Stephanos (edited 08-17-2001).]
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Originally posted by Orthodox Catholic: Dear Serge,
Yes, but . . .
The committed Swedish Lutheran laypeople, priests and monks I know are wonderful Christians and I am sure there are many more like them .
The fact that a Church may be "canonical" is not a guarantee that its members are in the "right" with God.
Which is not to say that Churches shouldn't be canonical . . .
And I think God may save a liberal or two in His own way
You never know . . .
AlexOnly if they repent. Alex ![[Linked Image]](https://www.byzcath.org/bboard/wink.gif)
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a sinner
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I came across a document that might provide interesting reading apropos of this discussion: "BISHOP, PRIEST AND DEACON IN THE CHURCH OF SWEDEN: A letter from the bishops concerning the ministry of the Church" found at: http://www.svenskakyrkan.se/arkeb/biskmote/beng901/httoc.htm
Martin
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