www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Help Please!!!

I am a Catholic, I'm converting to Orthodoxy
Now I'm wondering if I'm doing something wrong.
I understand the situation very well, but at the same time I feel like I'm not ready to abandon Rome, but at the same time I want to embrace Orthodoxy. I love the divine liturgy.
I just need some help with these areas
The Filioque
Original Sin
indulgences
Development of doctrine

if someone doesn't mind, I would be very greatful to them.

oh, papal infallibility too

Have you thought about an Eastern Rite church? I would email Fr Thomas Loya at Annunciation Byzantine Catholic Church in Chicago. They have a great website. I would put the website, but I am really bad with computers. Fr can explain many of these issues from an eastern position. He is also a poster on this Forum. His email is listed on the website.

Mruzi:

Christ is in our midst!! He is and always will be!!

IMHO, you need to take some time just to stop and do some sincere praying and soul searching. And I don't mean the kind of prayer where you tell God what it is you want.

Something has lead you to take a step from one Apostolic Church to the other. But be clear about what it is that you are doing. The flag that should make you pause and do some deep soul searching is the "wondering if I am doing something wrong." I am sure that any of our Orthodox priest members would tell you the same thing. We don't take this step if we think we might be doing "something wrong." That indicates to me that the reasons for your faith move are things that you have either not thought out in great detail or that there aren't enough reasons to make you positive as to what you are about to do.

Perhaps you need to talk to the Orthodox priest who is--I am assuming--giving you instruction and would be receiving you. Perhaps you need to speak to an Eastern Catholic priest about thees issues. Perhaps you need to speak to the priest who is your current pastor. At the very least you need to speak with someone with more experience in the spiritual life--someone who, himself, has struggled with the same sort of questions you have deep in there where you live.

ISTM that conversions based on theological issues like those you mention are not really at the root of the real reasons. If I were your spiritual father, I'd ask things like how is your prayer life going, what is it you are nourishing that prayer life with, and what has disturbed your prayer and study life. This is not to say that your call to conversion is not authentic or is not inspired or is not real. It is to say that one ought to do this for the right reasons and not for some reason(s) that leave you "wondering if I'm doing something wrong." At the risk of rousing the ire of our brethren here, may I suggest that you first determine your relationship with Christ and then decide where He is calling you to be. There is a great deal of difference in knowing about Him and knowing Him--something that has become a burnign issue in my own pilgrimage. It is in the knowing Him intimately that we come to the fearlessness necessary to take such a step and not be fearful of anything else: fearing to offend Him alone and abandoning ourselves to Him in whatever we finally decide to do and actually do.

The move to the Orthodox Church, if that is where the Lord is calling you, ought to be, ISTM, something that gives you an outpouring of the Holy Spirit--love, joy, peace, etc. It should never leave you second-guessing yourself.

In Christ,

BOB

Bob,

Thank you for the reply. You are right about a lot of things. A lot of it is rooted in how much I sin and a lot of it had to do with the liturgy it's self. It has always been quite difficult for me to enjoy the modern mass in the Roman rite for many reasons. A lot of that has caused me to look for something that I would consider to be deeper, and something that would force me to look for God in places I never thought I would find him, just like I'm doing with the Orthodox church. I can see the beautiful fruits of Byzantine Christianity working around me, however, when I go to recieve my sacraments in the RCC, it almost feels like I am moved and compelled to stay in communion with Rome.

My big fear is this :

If I do so, then everything that God has shown to me and revealed to my heart will be lost because my readings and my prayer life will be altered. I don't know how I would do it without the guidance of a spiritual father. I love eastern christianity, and there is nothing like that here. Everything that I have learned has been a huge blessing to me.

that is my dilemma

Mruzi:

I don't understand. We use the same Scripture and we share many of the same spiritual works. Besides that, nothing is ever "lost" in one's pilgrimage. What God has lead you to and what effect that it has had on your ongoing pilgrimage and growth in relationship to and with Him is never lost.

I have a little saying: "Love can never be divided or subtracted; it can only be added to or multiplied."

While there are many deep theological issues that divide Orthodox and Catholic Christians, there are ever so many things that we have in common when it comes to the practice of the faith. Both Churches encourage Scripture reading, regular confession, finding and staying with a spiritual father, regular daily prayer, spiritual reading, fasting. While the outward ways that these things are accomplished, the intended outcome is the same: the acquisition of the Holy Spirit of God; the growth in faith and life and spiritual understanding; growth in relationship with Our Lord Jesus Christ.

At the risk of scandalizing you, I will tell you that I began using the Orthodox prayerbook in university some 38 years ago, use Byzantine patristic sources for my spiritual reading, go regularly to confession, make and use icons, and am considered by many of my Latin brethren as an Orthodox Christian in their midst--though I do not call myself that. I stopped trusting many Latin sources during the excess period after Vatican II was over, only to find over the years that so many things we were told were mandated were not and that so many of the things discarded were not to be. I have struggled to keep the faith gift I was given and it has been nourished by this other source. There are many reasons I have not been Orthodox formally, not the least of which is that for many years I was nowhere near an Orthodox parish. I spent many long years studying and not knowing what or why I was being lead to study the various things I have studied. Orthodox Christianity is probably the only reason I practice as a Catholic Christian today--because while I was in the center of the storm after the Vatican Council when everything was being thrown away, Orthodox clergy and lay people were my encouragement in sticking with Christ. Were it not for them, I may have chucked in the towel and given up altogether.

The point is that the relationship with Christ and nourishing it is the important thing. The part of my pilgrimage that lets people see Christ in who I am is the important thing. Coming to meet Him eagerly at the end of my pilgrimage is the important thing. There are many of our brethren here who are greater lights in the Faith than I will ever be. They edify me. On the other hand, I have been placed where I am to rub up against so many unchurched people, so many wounded people, so many people who have heard nothing positive about the Church or Christ or Christian people. I give them--I hope--the kind of example I hope the Lord will be pleased with. I befriend them, I help them, and I pray for them: they are my lot and my portion.

My advice to you is to find Christ and put Him in the center of your life. He will lead you to where He wants you to be. He will do as He promised to "be with you until the end of the age."

Your brother in Christ,

BOB

There is an Eastern Catholic Church in Houston, Texas, St. John Chrysostom. Fr. Elias Rafaj is the pastor. Since you are in Texas, perhaps this would be a good connection for you...

Mruzi,
I think you should read the book Orthodox Spirituality by the Metropolitan of Nafpaktos Hierotheos.I found it very usefull in explaining the core differences in our traditions. Chad