www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Contradiction in Marital Theology?

Yes, there has been no contradiction regarding the TLM when it comes to the official documents issued by the Holy See. I was referring more to certain conservative Catholics who had taken a hard line on the issue prior to 2007, to the effect that you are not a good Catholic if you believe that the TLM had not been abrogated.

Yes, there are no contradictions among the immutable articles of faith. No one denies that.

However, in the past one hundred years, the theology of the Magisterium has often been interpreted to mean that not only the articles of faith, but even those teachings that are merely taught by the ordinary Magisterium (and as such have no dogmatic standing) or -- to be more accurate, are INTERPRETED by MOST theologians as being the teaching of the ordinary Magisterium -- cannot be dissented from, and must be practically (albeit not theoretically) considered as infallible as well.

Remember that Pope Pius XII declared that ANY matter of faith and morals upon which a papal encyclical declares, is no longer a matter of free discussion, even when no dogmatic definition is involved. Hence, the elaborate tables of Magisterial teaching and of errors that could be found in many a Catholic theological textbook prior to the 1950's.

We're straying too far from the topic, so I'll leave it there. I think a completely new thread would be needed for this.

OK
I would like to know why - if the girl is Byzantine Catholic
and the boy is Greek Orthodox - the marriage must take place in the Orthodox church. Why does the Orthodox church take place over the Byzantine Catholic Church when both are Eastern Rite.

I would assume that it is simply a matter of compromise on the part of the couple. I would assume that the compromise is more to appease the parents of the boy. Unfortunately, weddings can be delicate matters for some families, even in situations where the ethnicity and religion are the same.

Alice

Alice

I have always understood that the marriage of an Orthodox Christian has to be celebrated in an Orthodox Church for it to be recognised .

If it is a 'mixed' marriage , this will surely still hold and a Byzantine Catholic girl would , I'm sure understand this.

Perhaps one of the Priests could come in on this

Good points...

The situation may be the result of ecumenical agreements that have been reached between the Catholic Church and the Orthodox Churches. I've been told that in order to allow an Orthodox Christian to remain eligible for Holy Communion in his own Church, Catholic bishops will grant the Catholic partner permission to have a marriage in the Orthodox Church of the Orthodox partner. I've been to a few of them in my own area. It has nothing to do with one Church being "over" another.

It doesn't make some of the Catholic parents happy at times, but it does allow each person to remain eligible to remain in the sacramental life of his own church.

In Christ,

BOB

it is because orthodox Christians aren't allowed to marry outside the orthodox church

I think the examples of different sacramental ministries and Eucharistic species make the point.

1. The Church confers the sacraments. Jesus instituted the Sacraments. The Church cannot say, "this is now a sacrament" or "That is no longer a sacrament." All possible sacraments were evaluated by the early councils (including, for example, feet washing), and the seven we have were decided upon. So that's it.
2. The Church decides who confers the Sacraments. This is a matter of "discipline." For example, in the earliest centuries, only bishops could preside at the liturgy. Now, presbyters can. In the early church, only bishops, priests, deacons and, in extreme circumstances), acolytes (St. Tarcisius) could distribute Communion. Now, laity can.

So, the Latin Church says that the spouses can confer the sacrament on each other. The Byzantine Church says the priest must do it.

Those two practices have led to different spiritualities and apologetics, like many of the differin gpractices, but they do not imply a difference in theology.

Now, here's a new but related question:

In the Roman Church, part of the reason for marriage rules is practicality. Even today, Canon Law says that a couple can be married privately by a witness if a priest is not available.

This is to serve several purposes: for example, Catholics living in mission territories or rural areas where priests or deacons may not be available. Another one is when death is imminent, and for reasons of inheritance or just personal fulfillment, the couple want to marry before the terminally ill fiance dies.

The Roman Church says couples in those situations can marry before witnesses but that they must go to a priest or deacon as soon as one is available.

So, here's my question: what answer is there for couples in those situations in the Byzantine churches?

In the Middle East, among Copts, Eastern Orthodox (Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem), and Catholics, the couple weds in the man's church, and usually the new family worships as a family in that Church.

Although the Copts and the Catholics like to try and push towards their own Churches, this is a general custom.

The resultant marriage is recognised by the Churches of both parties to the marriage.

Am not sure, though, whether this is a custom, or whether it has come about due to the oppression by Muslims (which has resulted in a much greater sense of a unified Christendom, than exists in the West).

Bob is correct, at least insofar as the US. There is a formal document on the USCCB website expressing this as to relations between the Latin and Orthodox Churches. As to the EC and EO Churches, formal and informal arrangements have long addressed the issue, as Father Matta's reply suggests.

Many years,

Neil