www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News New apostolic administrator for Eparchy of Mukachevo

A few points, and then I'll resume my perpetual lurker status (since I'm an ancestor worshipper and not a Christian).

1) Is there such an order as "C.M." with a Byzantine branch? I've never heard of it.

2) Where is "Lechina" Slovakia? I've never heard of it--I would be surprised if this is a place in eastern Slovakia.

--> Is it possible that bishop-elect Milan Sasik is a member of the Latin Church?

There are a number of suitable (some would say ideal) candidates within the Eparchy right now, e.g., Father Taras Lovska who has degrees from Rome and is unmarried, currently a parish priest in Vynohradiv/Sevliush. He visited the USA several times in the late 1990s and even attended the Uniontown Otpust (twice).

And the current auxiliary bishop of Mukachevo, Djura Dzhudzhar, is not Ukrainian but is a Rusyn originally from Vojvodina, Yugoslavia, the Eparchy of Krizevci.

Seems that C.M. is the (Roman Catholic) Vincentian Fathers in Ukraine. (Congregatio Missionis)

http://www.rkc.lviv.ua/Cx1O.php3?L=e#CM

Alex,

You have painted for us a "Mommy, may I Church". Any visitor can read your post and go away thinking it is implied (from your Top Ten list) that Rome cannot put its money where its mouth is or that actions speak louder than words and that Rome doesn't necessarily mean what it sais or say what it means or that 'sui juris' is a nice term carrying empty calories (le symbolisme par-dessus la substance) or that the liturgy is the only safe haven for uninhibited tinkering.

I never heard of the Roman Catholic Vincentians. Who are they? What do they do? What connection do they have with Greek Catholics, Ruthenian and/or Ukrainian?

Good evening,

A note on the Congregation of the Mission, a/k/a the Vincentians: six Vincentians have served as bishops in several Eastern Churhces.

1. Bishop Lazarus Mladenov was Vicar Apostolic for Bulgarian Catholics of the Byzantine Rite in the late 19th century;

2. two Vincentians were elected to the episcopacy by the Chaldean Patriarchal Synod:

a. Archbishop Abraham Elias of Sehna (Teheran)
from 1938 to 1940.
b. Archbishop Abel Zayia of Urmyah and Salmas
from 1939 to 1951

3. two Vincentians have served as Patriarch of
Alexandria of the Copts:

a. Stephanos I Sidarouss
b. Stephanos II Ghattas
both were made cardinals

4. the present Metropolitan of Addis Abeba (sui iuris Church of Ethiopia), Archbishop Berhaneyesus Demerew Souraphiel.

Peace,

Charles

Charles,

How were the bishops elected for their churches if they belonged to a Roman Catholic religious order?

Unification under a Kyivan patriarchate, currently occupied by a Studite monk, doesn't seem to have any negative connotations as far as I can tell - a unified voice and ecclesiological presence for those of the Slavic liturgical tradition led by a monk of the restored authentic Byzantine monastic tradition. Isn't it in the Eastern ecclesiological tradition to belong to a patriarchal church? YES.

This seems a much more palatable situation ecclesiologically than the Latinized aberration we currently have - sui juris churches directly subject to a Roman dicastery (the Oriental Congregation). I for one can't see much positive in this current situation, which has precipitated a pseudo-Greek Catholic jurisdictionalism festered by microchurches sui juris who have no recourse above the bishop or archbishop except Rome.

We often accuse the Orthodox of being guilty of jurisdictionalism, but we seem to have our own flavor.

The Vatican II and subsequent documents all recommend the restoration (or creation, as appropriate) of Eastern Catholic patriarchates. This is purely for ecclesiological reasons and has nothing to do with nationalism (although that unfortunately can interfere).

The movement of the patriarchal sobor from L'viv to Kyiv is evidence that Patriarch Lubomyr wants to provide for the spiritual welfare of all the flock of the Kyivan-Ruthenian tradition, and reclaim the rightful place of the Patriarchate, and not just be a hierarch for the Galicians.

Bishops Ivan Semedi and Ivan Margytych were votings member of the Synod and were welcomed to all of the sobors. And both have ordained married priests now serving in the UGCC both in Europe and abroad. I don't know of any priests in the UGCC who currently think that the Uzhorod/Mukachevo eparchy is not part of the UGCC.

The recent canonical visit of Kyr Slavomir Miklosh to Metropolitan +Stefan in Philadelphia immediatly following his visit to Patriarch +Lubomyr, as well as his providing some married clergy for the UGCC in the diaspora I believe is also indicative of a movement towards a united patriarchate.

Let us pray for the new Bishop that he may have God's blessings in leading his flock and for working towards the restoration of a unified and stronger Greek Catholic Church.

Mnohaya Lita Vladyko! Eis Polla Eti, Despota!

Diak wrote: "Bishops Ivan Semedi and Ivan Margytych were votings member of the Synod and were welcomed to all of the sobors. And both have ordained married priests now serving in the UGCC both in Europe and abroad. I don't know of any priests in the UGCC who currently think that the Uzhorod/Mukachevo eparchy is not part of the UGCC."

So are the "Ruthenians" of Mukachevo simply doing what they did 350 years ago - seek shelter under a different umbrella? How long will it last, you think?

Will ecumenical efforts with our Sister Churches be hindered even more with the Carpatho-Russian Orthodox folks being under the Patriarch of Constantinople and our Mukachevo-Ruthenians being under the Kyievan Cardinal and the American Ruthenians being a 'sui juris' Church on this side of the pond? Who will the Slovak-Ruthenians be under? Is this an example of church unity or "One for all, and all for one, and every man for himself?" (Another Three Stooges famous saying, to add to Alex's reference to this classic trio).

Is Ecumenism dead? Can one speak about ecumenism and church unity if one's own church is split assunder?

I hope that Alex will do the TOP TEN lists more often! Then he will be our own "David Letterman" of this forum! Hee hee! Don't you all agree?

My comment on this subject, I resound the words of Patriarch Husar that the biggest problem with unity is the Bureucrats of the Vatican, not the pope himself.

So, I would prefer to be "under" the pope rather than to be "under" the Church of Rome, Vatican, bureucrats of Vatican, etc. But in my eyes, we should be in communion "WITH" the Pope (not "under").

I do sorely wish the other folks at the Vatican keep their runny nose out of our business!!! I wish that all the cardinals, bishops, etc. of the Roman Church keep their mitts off of our Church and butt out! Or I can be like ST. Nicholas, punch them in the nose. I really do have a beef with them. I don't have a problem with the pope at all. Do you guys understand what I mean?

I think that the Vatican government should be split in 5 ways (according to the 5 ancient Sees: Rome, Antioch, Constantinople, Jerusalem and Alexandria). So that the government will be equal to all the churches. But right now...it's all Roman. So then again I say this, I do have a beef with "the Vatican."

Long Live the Pope!

SPDundas
Deaf Byzantine

Joe,

Many Roman Catholic religious orders and congregations have members who belong to sui iuris Churches. The Redemptorists, Salesians, Franciscans, and Benedictines come to mind. Quite a few Redemptorists have been elected bishops in the UGCC. The retired eparch for Argentina is a Salesian. Bishop Julian Gbur, Eparch of Stryj, is a member of the Divine Word Missioners (SVD). The Salesians have provided an eparch for the Ethiopian Church.

On the other hand, there are quite a few Syro-Malabar priests who have been named bishops of Roman Catholic dioceses in India.

It is my understanding that the Ordaining Prelate for the Byzantine Catholic Church in Rome was, until a few years ago, Bishop Andrei Katkoff, M.I.C. A Marian of the Immaculate Conception. I also believe that Vladyka Andrei was born in Kursk of Orthodox parents but was received into full communion with Rome in his early days and from there he bacame a Marian of the Immaculate Conception. I also believe that Vladyka Andrei was the first episcopal appointment of Blessed John XXIII. Charles Bransom would be able to correct any of my error here.
Silouan, monk

"My comment on this subject, I resound the words of Patriarch Husar that the biggest problem with unity is the Bureucrats of the Vatican, not the pope himself."

Most non-Catholics always mention the Pope as the problem, but here you state that it is the "bureaucrats" of the Vatican. Would Cardinal Husar be echoing the words of Archbishop Joseph Raya? [In his "Face of God" book, Raya rants against the Vatican bureaucracy in one of his footnotes regarding canon law and how Rome keeps changing it on them.] Who picks the bureaucrats? What do we make of Husar being one of the Vatican's Cardinals? Is this a self-criticism? I am confused.

We have to get our own house in order first before we can worry too much about ecumenism. Which bishop sui iuris does what? The Melkites don't have that problem because they have a PATRIARCH who speaks for their church with one voice. The traditional Eastern Christian ecclesiastical structure is patriarchal. It's not a new or novel concept. And it does work, judging by the Melkites.

But it is an Eastern concept, which may be a hindrance for those more inclined to their comfortable Latinized existence. Perhaps there are those who wish to remain in fractionated, localized sui juris churches fettered to Roman dicasteries. Not me.

In order to regain our Eastern identity, it will entail regaining our Eastern ecclesiological structure as well. This can only help ecumenical efforts having a strong Patriarch speaking for his church in a united voice as the Melkites have.

"In order to regain our Eastern identity, it will entail regaining our Eastern ecclesiological structure as well. This can only help ecumenical efforts having a strong Patriarch speaking for his church in a united voice as the Melkites have."

Diak,

What recommendations do you make for the Ruthenian Church, which is now segmented into four distinct groups: (1) The Mukachevo-Ukrainians, (2) the Slovak-Greek Catholics, (3) the American 'sui juris' Byzantine Catholics, and (4) our Sister Church (one of them) Carpatho-Russian Orthodox? Did Ruthenians ever have an Eastern ecclesiastical structure? Is there a possiblity for one now?

Comments appreciated.

Bishop Andrei Katkoff was the third bishop named by Blessed John XXIII. He was appointed coadjutor of Archbishop Alexander Evreinoff, and succeeded him on August 20, 1959. Bishop Andrei died on September 18, 1995. He was consecrated bishop by Archbishop Evreinoff, assisted by Archbishop Ivan Bucko and Bishop Paul Meletiev on December 21, 1958. He was born in Irkutsk, Siberia, on October 26, 1916 and was ordained a priest on July 30, 1944.

Here is Archbishop Joseph Raya's blurb on Canon Law and Roman Bureaucracy:

"Here we should comment on the reluctance of Easterners to accept a "Canon Law." For them, a fixed and rigid Canon Law such as in the West is a death-blow to life in Christ. It is despotic clericalism where some bureaucrats separate the dynamism of life into small compartments in order that they can fit them into static categories, the easier for "authority" to manipulate. This lack in confidence in such "Canon Law" has produced a certain rejection and even hatred on the part of Easterners. As soon as some "Canon Law" is written for them, it stirs up controversies and battles with the Orthodox Church. Then, the Romans who wrote it realize their mistake and change it. Since the first beautifully organized "Canon Law" for the Eastern Church in 1917, we have had five radical changes in the so-called "Oriental Canon Law" which have created heated controversies and divisions within the Church." ("The Face of God: Essays in Byzantine Spirituality," by Archbishop Joseph M. Ray, God With Us Publications, 1976, footnote 4, page 218)

Of course, this was written a decade or so BEFORE a new Canon Law was written for the Easterners!

How does this compare to Alex Letterman's Top Ten?