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Among Ukrainian Catholics and Maronites (probably others), the understanding of purgatory is identical to what Roman Catholics believe. Asking them to change what they've always believed would just add confusion.

Therein lies the problem...

They can't be asked to change, what they believe is an immutable dogma.

The devil is the sower of confusion. What do you mean? I hoped my remark was an acknowledgment that we, the BCC, need to properly explain our position.

Based on your buildup and prejudging as stated, do you really anticipate an honest dialogue?

The faith I live and profess and know does not fit your characterization. The articulation I note is predominantly internal to Eastern Catholics, specifically in my case, the BCC. That it is not (yet) articulated, or that I may be poorly informed about it, does not mean that it is nonexistent. The faith I live informs me otherwise.

Lawrence,

A pretty sweeping statement! At the dogmatic level? At the level of popular piety? Both?

Fr. Deacon Daniel

Yes, I was saying if there is lack of a clear explanation, than I could see how people could be confused.

I agree.

In this case, AMM, nothing about the place most commonly referred to as Purgatory is "immutable dogma" except that (1) it is a place of some sort of cleansing of sin for those who will eventually enter Heaven, and (2) prayers of us believers here on Earth are efficacious for those souls. That's pretty much it. Beyond that, the rest is just pious speculation.

Alexis

Dear Father Deacon,

Actually, Lawrence is quite right. Only a handful of parishes/persons in my Eparchy would not suffer confusion and even real spiritual damage if the teaching on Purgatory was discontinued.

And this is especially given the fact that so many Divine Liturgies are served and attended for the dead by so many parishioners up here.

The first question that would come to mind would be, "If they're not in Purgatory, are they in hell?!"

Horrors!

Alex

Dear AMM,

I agree that change would be difficult - and I would argue it to be unnecessary in many parishes where Purgatory is accepted as part of spiritual life and praxis. In fact, St Peter Mohyla of Kyiv taught about Purgatory and it was widely accepted in the Kyivan Baroque era (yes it was Latinized).

For many EC's in my Church, Purgatory answers categorically the question "Where do souls go who are unworthy of either heaven or hell?"

Frankly, I find the Eastern Orthodox explanation to be one requiring a bit more theological sophistication than we Ukrainian Greek Catholics have traditionally been known for!

And if we're going to keep Purgatory, then leave us to our indulgences too!

Alex

That sounds alot like Orthodoxy to me, though we call it a foretaste or forecourt of Heaven... When it comes to the afterlife, no one really knows, do they?!?

The saints of Roman Catholicism know that the Virgin Mary told them to pray for the poor souls in purgatory.

The saints of Orthodoxy have been told to pray for the soul...etc., etc., etc.,

We both know that prayer will purify a soul that has not been damned...

Sounds like nothing more than word semantics seperating us...

If only someone could come back from the dead to tell us for sure!

NOW--getting back on topic....

Alice

I was actually referring to the IC, though that's not what Lawrence wrote. Whoops!

I actually think there is more to Purgatory than you say as outlined here

I would say that at my former Greek Catholic parish, this was pretty much true. The belief in purgatory was the same as that of the Roman Catholic church down the street.

Dear Alice, here is one Orthodox response to the Latin doctrine of purgatory.

http://www.orthodoxinfo.com/death/stmark_purg.aspx

Joe