www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Journey begins toward convening of pan-Orthodox synod

We do ?? !!

The Orthodox whom I know are fiercely resistant to any changes in our worship.

Thank you Father. I have not noticed any liturgical changes
in my Orthodox Church. And I agree that there is no need.

I wonder which jurisdiction the author was talking about.

Forgive me if my posts here seem redundant but twice in Father Ambrose's post which I took the quotes from I read it is best to "let sleeping dogs lie". I suppose as long as everything looks good from the outside the rest is better left "under the rug". This is all none of my business anyway so I will digress.

Personally, I think the article is full of triumphalistic nonsense. Mr. Schaeffer is also no longer Orthodox IIRC.

In my opinion waiting for the Synod is like waiting for Godot, and what this reflects is a deep level of inner dysfunction that we can't really make an excuse for.

He is not Orthodox anymore?

I may have misspoken on that. Regardless, everything I have ever read by him strikes my as angry and divisive.

Before we get off on a tangent on this, according to Frank Schaeffer's own website, http://www.frankschaeffer.com/ claims that he still considers himself an Orthodox Christian. Any additional comments and questions regarding Mr Schaeffer should be on a thread of its own.

In IC XC,
Father Anthony+
Administrator

Sorry.

"Let sleeping dogs lie" is a very ancient Orthodox principle. :-)


Failure to observe it in Russia under Patriarch Nikon led to approximately 30% of the Russian Orthodox Church leaving the Church and forming the Old Believer (Starovery) Churches. That schism still besets us after 400 years.

Failure to observe it 80 years ago with regard to the Calendar has led to major continuing schisms in the Churches of Greece, Bulgaria and Romania.

Calling a Great and Holy Council today may have similar catastrophic results for the Church, especialy if the Council causes the Greek and Russian Churches to vie for supremacy in the Orthodox world. This could split Orthodoxy in two. Much better to "let sleeping dogs lie" and allow this vexed question to work itself out slowly and organically over the next couple of centuries.

Well, the Russian Orthodox Church and, I would presume, the Jerusalem Patriarchate are quite resistant to changes, and as I've repeatedly noted in this very forum there are apparently moves in some Orthodox jurisdictions towards the fuller celebration of the divine services.

However, neither should we be blind to the fact that there are those in OCA and the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese who have hinted at the need for major liturgical reform. (No, I am not referring to the drive for more use of the vernacular.) And, as has been noted elsewhere, it was the drive of some Antiochene bishops towards the fuller observance of liturgical and disciplinary traditions that apparently triggered Metropoitan Philip's crackdown on their authority.

And isn't this article [touchstonemag.com] nice?


And, did not the Serbian Patriarchate and the State Church of Greece recently mandate praying some formerly "secret" prayers aloud? Granted that that is not really radical... it is still a notable change.

The Serbian Synod did propose reading the secret prayers aloud at Liturgy and also having the Holy Doors open. One Diocesan bishop "jumped the gun" and attempted to implement the changes of his own volition just before holy Pascha (is it two years or three years ago?) The result was chaos in the diocese. Parish priests and monasteries refused to implement the changes. The bishop responded by suspending these priests - in the week before Holy Week (!!) which would have meant monasteries and parishes without Services for Holy Week and Easter.

The Laity stepped in and staged a street protest, picketing the Patriarchal Chancellory in Belgrade during Holy Week. Vox populi, vox Dei.

To my knowledge the changes have not been introduced, at least not in my local Diocese where the priests would simply ignore them.

Is this in America or globally? Which "jurisdictions" do you have in mind?


I sometimes take note that the Orthodox in America constitute less than 1% (one percent) of global Orthodoxy. It is fragmented and quarrelsome and almost completely lacking in the richness of monastic life (that acid barometer of the spiritual health of any Church) and the very small number of theologians and liturgists cannot compare with those in Russia or those in the universities of Greece. This is not to insult our brothers and sisters in the United States -but simply to add a perspective.

A most enjoyable article - thanks for posting the link. But it seems that my education is severely lacking; I graduated from High School in 1960, without ever once having been asked to memorize the Periodic Table of elements. However, at one time I could sing the whole list in Tom Lehrer's version.

Did everyone know that there is an element called "ruthenium"?

Fr. Serge

Evloyeite!

Agreed, dear Father, that monastic life is essential to the spiritual health of any church, however, it is not lacking any more thanks to Father Ephraim of the Holy Mountain and his directive from God.

Respectfully in Christ,
Alice

Dear Father Ambrose,
Thank You! I do believe I understand your rationale here. As long as the spiritual needs of the faithful are being met leave these matters between the individual hierarchs who hopefully will work them out in their own good time. I guess I can buy into that.

Bless,
Bill