www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Rusyn Pysanky

Pavloosh

Ukrainians arrived in the USA in four distinct waves: 1880-1914, 1923-1939, 1948-1956 and 1990-2006. At the beginning of the 20th century, immigrants from what is now Ukraine came to USA seeking work. The first wave were barlely conscious of their ethnonational identity, and these earliest immigrants called themselves Rusyns (Ruthenians). Thanks to the socio-educational efforts of Easter-rite Ukrainian Catholic and Orthodox priests, some Rusyns began calling themselves Ukrainians, developing a distinct national identity in concert with their brethren in Ukraine. The Rusyns selected their nickname 'Ukraine / Ukrainians' to distinguish themselves from the Muscovites who who had usurped the term Rusyn to become Rossijany (Russians). If you have Rusyns and Russians living together, people will get confused about who is who so the name switch was needed. You appear to be the progeny of some of those immigrants who switched and identify yourself as Ukrainian just as I identify myself as French.

There are some USA citizens who are the progeny of the early immigrants who have never made the switch and prefer to use the old term 'Rusyn. The same holds true for Ukraine, but according to the last Ukrainian census the number of Rusyns in Ukraine was about 12,000.

Rusyn or Ukrainian - tomayto or toematoe - they are the same thing. Therefore, the term 'pysanky / pysanka' are equally Rusyn and Ukrainian. Don't worry - be happy.

I.F.

Reading some of these Ukrainan histories a person would be forgiven for thinking that the Grand Prince of Kiev and his family ruled a tiny place and not a huge slice of land that went way north of the city of Kiev and included Moscow. You also did not mention the role of the Austrians in pushing the new designation of Ukrainian among the Rusyns who worried them so much with their always looking over border to Russia. Latinisations were introduced to keep them safe and different from the people across the border. It was not hard to do with no one in among the Greek Catholics holding any position in the church who was not 100% loyal to the Hapsburgs. Vienna told them to jump and they in their best German asked how high. Vienna liked the new label of Ukrainian very much. Divide and conquer worked wonders here and also split these people off from the Rusyns in the Hungarian Kingdom. A split kept going in the USA today. Lets face it the People call the Russ evolved into a number of Slavic ethnic groups. This was never a problem for the great Servant of God Metroplitan Andrew who never stooped to this low level snipping against the other Slavic groups of what was called Russian in his day.

Jean Francois:
I am a citizen of the United States of America and of Ukrainian descent - am very,very proud of both.
Pavloosh

P.S. Je vous souhaite de nombreux moments!

In order to get "Rusyn psyanky" for this person, it would be helpful to know what village or area their family roots are in since each area does it's own speciific style of egg. Some regions use a kistka or trebica while others use a straight pin or nail and still others use goose feathers.

Please feel free to have them contact me off-list and I will try help as much as I can.

So many eggs, so little time....

Dear Pavel,

These are a few basic errors with your statement:

(1) Contrary to what you state, Moscow did not exist in the era of Kyvian-Rus. Simply Google any map of the era and you will see that Moscow did not yet exist.

(2) Contrary to what you state, the Austro-Hungarian Empire did not support or like the new label 'Ukrainian' (name for collective of Rusyn peoples). In fact, Austrians, Hungarians, and later Poles and Slovaks prefered the term Rusyn (Galician Rusyn, Carpatho Rusyn, etc...) since they could claim these as distinct peoples whom they could continue to dominate as minorities in their Empire - or as you said "divide and conquer". With the name change from Rusyn to Ukrainian the Austrians and Hungarians, and later the Poles and Slovaks feered a new large nation which they could not dominate.

(3) Your assesment of why "Latinizations" were introduced is an oversimplification of historical facts. There were many reasons for Latinizations.

(4) Contrary to what you state very few of the clergy in both Galicia and the Carpathian Mountains spoke German. The Galician Greek Catholics Rusyn clergy were fluent in Polish, and those Rusyn clerics in the Carpathian Mountains spoke Hungarian. Contrary to what you state, if the Greek-Catholic Clergy were given orders to "jump in German" they probably would not have understood.

(5) Contrary to what you have stated, Ukrainians are not "stooping to snipping against other slavic groups" but simply upholding historical facts and a desire to remain independent. Very often these facts are incongruent with Russian Empire and Soviet history.

I.F.

Wow! Someone e-mailed and asked for information on Rusyn Pysanky and you have turned it into a fight! What will they think of us when they come to this thread for information?

Thread is now closed.