www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Italian media speculates: Vatican will announce massive reception

A friend of mine, who is in precisely the situation you describe, was told by a Catholic bishop that he is, in legal terms, an 'apostate', and would therefore be in need of a 'very good canon lawyer' if he wanted to return to the fold and serve as a priest.

The Vatican initiative may have a greater influence in England than in the USA.

http://www.ewtn.com/vnews/getstory.asp?number=98427

Christ is in our midst!! He is and always will be!!

While all the speculation goes on about the hows of Anglicans coming into the Catholic Church through this new avenue, does anyone feel the pain that is coming through the statements these two Anglican bishops are feeling deep down inside where only the Lord can really see?

I, for one, believe that this must be a soul-wrenching experience. One does not become a member of the clergy without a very deep commitment and a profound leap of faith. It is something that is counter-cultural, no matter what country one is in or what Church or group one belongs to. And to finally come to these conclusions has to tear one's spiritual fabric in a fundamental way.

Or am I off on this one?

BOB

Bob that is so very true. Coming from a COE background and having family serving as clergy I know first hand how the changes in that church have been extremely painful. The move will be extremely sad for most.

Dear Brothers and Sisters in Christ,

Christ is truly among us!

Someone asked why it is so important to speak of the SSPX, Anglicans, and others on an Eastern Forum. I have prayed a lot about it today, and feel I have my reply, so here goes for what it is worth.

This is not about my life, but why this is important in not just my life, but all of our lives. You see our background makes us newcomers of sort to the Eastern Church, only since 1979 have we belonged. Before that I was Southern Baptist and my husband, Fr. Deacon Stan, PNC.

My family was German, Irish, and English on my dad's side, and all left the Catholic Church, as close as I can tell, at the Reformation. My coming HOME is a part of the 'restoration' of God's people, in a very small way of course, but still part of it. God faithfully brought me home to the church of my fathers.

How often have we known people that prayed for the conversion of someone then fussed, because the people have changed their lives. People will say oh how dare, they look at him, holier than thou. Hummm....

In Matthew 12:39-42, Then some of the scribes and Pharisees said to him, "Teacher, we wish to see a sign from you."
He said to them in reply, "An evil and unfaithful generation seeks a sign, but no sign will be given it except the sign of Jonah the prophet....At the judgment, the men of Nineveh will arise with this generation and condemn it, because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and there is something greater than Jonah here.

Jonah preached repentance, the people heard the Word of God, and repented. They rejoiced because they had come to the freedom and fullness that God intended for them.

Jonah 3: 9
Who knows, God may relent and forgive, and withhold his blazing wrath, so that we shall not perish." Isn't that what we want? Do we fail to understand the significance of His Church being divided, the effect that it has on this hurting world.

However, Jonah was mad, he went out and sat under a bush, longing to dye, rather than rejoicing in God's mercy and love for His children.

Jonah 4:1-10, But this was greatly displeasing to Jonah, and he became angry. "I beseech you, LORD," he prayed, "is not this what I said while I was still in my own country? This is why I fled at first to Tarshish. I knew that you are a gracious and merciful God, slow to anger, rich in clemency, loathe to punish. And now, LORD, please take my life from me; for it is better for me to die than to live." But the LORD asked, "Have you reason to be angry?" Jonah then left the city for a place to the east of it, where he built himself a hut and waited under it in the shade, to see what would happen to the city. And when the LORD God provided a gourd plant, that grew up over Jonah's head, giving shade that relieved him of any discomfort, Jonah was very happy over the plant. But the next morning at dawn God sent a worm which attacked the plant, so that it withered. And when the sun arose, God sent a burning east wind; and the sun beat upon Jonah's head till he became faint. Then he asked for death, saying, "I would be better off dead than alive." But God said to Jonah, "Have you reason to be angry over the plant?" "I have reason to be angry," Jonah answered, "angry enough to die." Then the LORD said, "You are concerned over the plant which cost you no labor and which you did not raise; it came up in one night and in one night it perished. And should I not be concerned over Nineveh, the great city, in which there are more than a hundred and twenty thousand persons who cannot distinguish their right hand from their left, not to mention the many cattle?"

Brothers and Sisters, I want to rejoice in the majesty of God's work that is unfolding before our very eyes, in our life time, we are part of an amazing event in mankind's history. This is/should be our only goal, Phillipians 1:21
For to me life is Christ, and death is gain.

Put alway the childishness of the flesh, Christ said In Luke12:49 "I have come to set the earth on fire, and how I wish it were already blazing!" Why in the world does anyone want to try to stop the Holy Spirit though moaning and groaning of what was. It is past, a new thing is among us. Is. 43:18-20,Remember not the events of the past, the things of long ago consider not;See, I am doing something new! Now it springs forth, do you not perceive it? In the desert I make a way, in the wasteland, rivers.Wild beasts honor me, jackals and ostriches, For I put water in the desert and rivers in the wasteland for my chosen people to drink, The people whom I formed for myself, that they might announce my praise.

Then in John 10:27-30 My sheep hear my voice; I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish. No one can take them out of my hand.My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one can take them out of the Father's hand. The Father and I are one."

Why in the world would anyone complain or be unhappy that Jesus is bring his Church back together? We have all sinned, we have all fallen short of the glory to God. Yet, there are those like Jonah, who desire to sit under the bush and grieve, because things are not their way.

I apologize for offending anyone, but someone asked.

I say as the Psalms so loudly proclaim REJOICE in the Lord. I prefer to be a part of God's restoration that I see unfolding before my eyes and rejoice, in each of his moves - though they often appear to have a lot of right and left turns with His straight lines. I am sure glad I am not the one in charge of things, mankind seems to make an awful mess of it. It is not an easy thing that is happening, families and churches are bring torn assunder, but then again Christ did not say he came to bring peace, sadly too many families are at odds with each other because of their faith and trust in Christ, and many will be without their love ones to follow Christ to his home here on earth, the Eucharistic Sacrament of He who is the Altar. God's word is true and he is faithful. Thanks be to God, HE IS LORD!

One thought I forgot to ad, is it is about obedience and authority. Christ was obedient to his Father even unto death. Authority he gave to the Apostles - HIS authority. Where else are people going to turn, when they come unto total understanding that as Protestants they have left not received or shared in the 'sacramental nature' of the Church that Christ established for them. I believe that is the Roman Catholic Church. But, whether they go East(Catholic or Orthodox) or West, they must come home to the Sacraments to have the fullness of life that God intended for them in this world.

Truly glad to read these words. Obedience is most important. After all it is the first vote (commitment?) in the monastic life.

I listened to the Bishop of Chichester's speech at the FIF Conference online and didn't have this tone. If this report on EWTN is based on the Times article, that was shown to be inaccurate. I don't expect any mass exodus for Rome.

The EWTN release quotes Bishop Broadhurst of Fulham as having said that:


However, this is a bit strange: the Church of England, and the Anglican Communion, do not claim to have any doctrine of their own, but rather to teach the Faith of the undivided Church (and please don't ask me where and when this "undivided Church" was). Bishop Broadhurst would certainly know this. I would presume that he is saying that the Church of England has departed from the Faith of the Undivided Church.

Fr. Serge

Why else would they be considering leaving?

Anyway, the Church isn't divided, but whatever.

Alexis

Here's a link to the Diocese of Chichester with the Bishop's statement about the reporting of his speech.

Bishop of Chichester's response [diochi.org.uk]

I think he touches on an issue that will be central for many, the issue of orders. I think that will hold many back, as will the issue of divorce and re-marriage.

Clearly, the EWTN article misinterpreted the Bishop's statement. As Bishop Hind stated on his web page.

I think that the title of this thread speaks volumes. ". . . media speculates . . ." And I think it would be well for all of us to step back and remember that. There's a lot of hype and people jumping to conclusions that are not founded on fact and clear thinking. Let's wait until the dust clears and see what official statements say and how they are interpreted by those issuing them.

People, though well-intentioned, always come from their own perspective and interpret what they hear through it. That's probalby what happened with His Grace' statements. Remember that nuance is not what sells newspapers or make for good 30-second sound bites.

BOB