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I don't have this year's Annuario Pontificio, but my impression is that the Holy See continues to syle the Pittsburgh Metropolia as "Byzantine-Ruthenian". If however that Church prefers to call itself "Byzantine sui iuris Catholic" the rest of us are apt to scratch our heads in wonder but then agree that since nobody else wants that title, we would not have much of a reason to object! However, this is an uncertain prospect, since the Pittsburgh Metropolia does, to some extent, like to emphasize its historic connections with Uzhhorod, Preshov, Hajdudorog, Krizhevtsi, and some more recent derivatives in Eastern Europe. Me, I'm more the sui generis type. Incognitus

MJ,

Thank you for your reply and I stand corrected that it is not the offical name but the popular practice.

I will note though, that most of the parishes I have past list Byzantine Catholic on their signs.

I will also note that when I say Byzantine Catholic Church, that the pastor at the Melkite parish I attend knows exactly what I am talking about.

Also as, Byzantine Metropolitan Church sui iuris of Pittsburgh, is a mouthful to say as well as type I will continue to use Byzantine Catholic Church.

Like it or lump it. :p


David

Dear Byzantine Catholics:

What's in a name? PLENTY!

Presently, I think there are three distinct Ruthenian Catholic jurisdictions, as gleaned from Fr. Roberson's guide to the Eastern Catholic Churches:

(1) the Ruthenian Byzantine Catholic Metropolitanate in the United States, a metropolitan church sui iuris (DavidB's Byzantine Catholic Church in America);

(2) the eparchy of Muka�evo in Ukraine, which is immediately subject to the Holy See; and

(3) the Apostolic Exarchate in the Czech Republic.

The relationship among the three has not been clarified. The bishop of Muka�evo is listed as head of the church, but he has no authority over the other two jurisdictions. Of course, Metrolpolitan Archbishop Basil heads the Pittsburgh Metropolia, or BCCA.

The 3 distinct and separate jurisdictions have a combined membership figure of almost 600,000.

In other areas of the diaspora, including Australia, Great Britain, and Canada, Ruthenian Catholics are not distinguished from Ukrainian Catholics.

Does this clarify or muddle the picture? :p

AmdG

This whole name game is one reason that our church will die. Does it matter what our Church calls itself this decade?

The last failed company I worked for changed its name and restructured several times in six years. The employees remained the same and we at least got a new baseball hat with the new company name and logo on it each time. More memos were cranked out on internal protocol and management charts than sales strategy. Glossy in-house newsletters went beyond the call of duty depicting our company leaders conducting all sorts of meaningless meetings on cost control. However, nobody noticed the ultra-high quality of glossy paper our in-house newsletter was printed on. One former general manager got a promotion simply because he successfully made us comply with the document formats of our German-owned perent company.

Sales didn't really matter.

We might not have gotten too many orders in order to survive, but we did have a precision on company titles and proper stationary formats.

The name changes didn't prove a d*mn thing!

The only thing the customers remembered was the high prices in our quotes. We weren't focused on what really mattered: being honest on what will keep us alive and making the necessary and appropriate economic changes for our survival.

So, back to the initial news quote I first posted ... unless we are accused of spiritual ADD.

Thanks,
Joe

Well, that's just great. Now not only will we have to explain to people what "Byzantine" is, but also what "Metropolitan" means here, AND what the heck sui iuris means!

Oh, I long for the days when everyone just called us "The Russian Church" (as opposed to "the Slovak Church", "the Polish Church", "the Irish Church", "the Italian Church"... :rolleyes: ) Life was so much simpler then...

Can this thread be shut down - due to lack of interest and insight - and another one be started on Church names? Thank you.

Joe

Since "Greek Catholic" seems to be still used by a number of other jurisdictions, the term, "Ruthenian Greek Catholic Church" would have sufficed just fine to identify the Pittsburgh Metropolia, to clearly separate it from the Greek Catholic Church of the Ukrainians (God-forbid for some, that the two be too closely associated).

I understand that in the 50s, Bishop Elko et al felt that Greek Catholic was misleading, since none of our people were ethnically Greek. Byzantine was seen as a more generic term indicating the particular rite employed. Still in that day also, the term, "Byzantine-Slavonic Rite" was popular, but this name was not of course, exclusive to the Pittsburgh Exarchate.

While "Greek Catholic" may have appeared confusing to the powers that were in the 50s and 60s, think about this: Does anyone really confuse the term "Roman Catholic Church" with the idea that all of its members are of Roman or Italian descent or "Latin Rite" as meaning that the members are either Latinos or once spoke Latin? Certainly not. So, why the great concern in this country with using our time-honored name of "Greek Catholic" and qualifying it with "Ruthenian" when necessary?

In another sense, the following can compare:

Roman Catholic/Byzantine Catholic (using the name of the former empires)
Latin Catholic/Greek Catholic (emphasizing historical language and custom)

Byzantine Metropolitan Church sui ijuris of Pittsburgh is fine if one wants to be technical, but its words are far too unfamiliar to the masses to be a practical choice to use as a common name. Additionally, another way to translate this name would be "Byzantine Autocephalous Metropolitan Church of Pittsburgh" since "autocephalous" is a correct translation of sui ijuris, but I doubt that its implications would go over very well with the Roman Curia. "Byzantine Ruthenian Metropolitan Church of Pittsburgh" is perhaps a bit more identifiable to others, but also, too unknown to many to be accepted at a popular level.

Give me the good old name "Greek Catholic" and qualify it with Ruthenian if one wishes. Believe it or not, "Greek Catholic" is still very understandable to a large portion of the Roman Catholic community as well as to others and is still preferred often in worldwide circles. But I agree with others that while we are still fretting over what name or longer titles to use, the church will continue to shrink before our very eyes, if we do not focus on the contributing issues.

God bless you all,

Fr. Joe

May I ask why the article I posted is not worth commenting on? Why the fascination with church names instead?

Joe

Since this thread has wandered from the original disucssion I'm going to close it. Please free to begin new discussions on these topics.