www.byzcath.org Forums Mysteries: The Life of Worship Icons & Iconography Glass Iconostasis

St. Anne Ukrainian Catholic Church in Warrington, PA will be blessing its new iconostasis: http://www.ukrarcheparchy.us/way/THEWAY100627ENG.pdf (scroll down to page 8). It appears to made of glass with etched images of Christ, the Theotokos, and two seraphims.

It's been discussed in previous threads about the movement to a more open style of iconostasis- but, this one looks like quite a leap!

Slava Isusu Khrestu

[text regarding an unrelated topic has been separated into another thread]

The glass iconostasis, I don't like.

The whole concept of the theology of colour as found in iconography seems missing. I remember learning about the uses of colours,the movement from dark to light and the actual lines. Yes, I know that in Romania and parts of Bukovina in UKraine writing/painting with colour in reverse on glass is possible. Yet, these all spoke to me and but the glass as I see it does not do it. Again,I am just one person.

Unworthy
Kolya

I don't like it, either. They are not ugly, but they definitely violate the traditional rules of icon writing.

Dn. Robert

The clergy had better be careful swinging the kadylo.

I think it is interesting!

It might not be my absolute personal favourite, or my personal choice, but obviously, the congregation liked it or they would not have chosen it...I wonder if it was less expensive than a more traditional iconastasis, and if, perhaps that was a determining factor?

I like the way, in the 'new' country of the U.S., Eastern church interiors have kept their traditional beauty while adopting innovative approaches that are not offensive...

Ofcourse, as the French say: 'chacun a son gout' ('to each his own')!!

here's my 2 cents worth:

I think they are quite beautiful.

but still quite wrong.

I don't think they understand how icons and the iconostas function for the Divine Services in the prayer of the faithful.

Seems they have succumbed to notion that they are merely religious decorations and not in themselves foci for worship. Too bad. They are missing out.

Still the good news is that it looks as if they might be easily movable, maybe they can move them to the doors between the vestibute and the narthex or to the doors between the narthex and the sanctuary.

Of course the knottier question remains, are they to be kissed or not? If "yes", then they should probably have a spray bottle of windex very handy at all times....

In Romania, Moldavia and Bukovina there is a tradition of iconography on glass.

There are several competing impetuses I see at work...
1) the Kyivan trdition for non-solid iconostasi so that the faithful can be aware of (especially by hearing) the actions in the sanctuary,
2) the instructive and symbolic need for the Iconostasis to "wall off" the sanctuary,
3) the human desire to see the sanctuary,
4) the need for iconography as focus for veneration,
5) and the rubrical need to place that iconography upon the divider between sanctuary and nave.

Well done glass iconography would fill this nicely; a layer of Plexiglas forming a sandwich (Plexi-glass-plexi) like a triple pane window would protect the glass from a stray censor or ripidia.

I didn't like what I saw in the photo in the PDF, but it doesn't "bother" me, either.

Then again, I miss Monsignor Michael's filigree ironwork iconostas at St Nicks... the wood one is gorgeous, but the old filigree one was a similar compromise to seeing the Altar, holding the Icons, and defining the sanctuary.

I don't like it myself-true, personally i much prefer solid ikonostasy, but this goes beyond taste. With post-iconoclast iconography there is a sense of realism that must be maintained-perhaps not a naturalistic reality, but a dipictable, if spiritualized, reality nonetheless. We can have images because the Uncircumsribable became circumscribable through the Incarnation. When we look at an icon of a saint, do we not see the saint in his resurrected glory? Does not the icon participate in that reality? What I see here is translucent-ghosts. My immediate thought was that I was seeing ghosts, and as such, this "iconostasis" denies the Resurrection both of our Lord and the Theotokos.

For what it's worth, I have a Romanian glass icon, and it is opaque, not translucent (unless one perhaps takes the back off and shines a very strong light through it). It's not like stained glass, but painted like regular icons, except backwards, starting with the top layers and going to the bottom.

In Christ,
Adam

Most of the older extant wooden churches have full iconostases from floor to ceiling with multiple rows of icons, so I am not sure what you mean here.

I just hope the kadylo does not get too close to the iconostas, or an altar server trips near one of these panels.


Like most iconography there are multiple styles; I have seen them not entirely translucent, as this thing being discussed, but with some small areas left translucent such as a mandorla that sort of self-illuminates. I don't disagree that this example being discussed goes far outside of even the glass icon convention.

I think the best compromise would be painting the figures and leaving the background clear...

The unfortunate part to me is that these are not unique, and probably purchased from a catalogue, or least some mass-producing glass manufacturer. The panes with the angels that are on the deacon's doors are exactly the same thing that are on the doors that separate the vestibule and the nave in my former parish of Holy Trinity in New Britain, CT.

I haven't been able to visualize the iconostasis closely enough to tell - but I'd echo John's observation that I think I've seen these before - again, on the doors separating the vestibule and nave, but at the Melkite Cathedral.

I haven't been able to remember from whence those originated (they were added in the 90s). They are actually very attractive in that particular setting - I'm still reserving judgement in the matter under discussion here.

Many years,

Neil

http://stanneukrainiancc.com/photo.html (scroll down to 4th photo)

I guess it will soon be the first time anyone will ever say the sentence "sorry for breaking the iconostasis"

Link is dead.