2 members (San Nicolas, 1 invisible),
444
guests, and
112
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums26
Topics35,533
Posts417,706
Members6,185
|
Most Online4,112 Mar 25th, 2025
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 53
Member
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 53 |
Just out of my curiosity, and our parish does not have daily D.L. How is a daily divine liturgy conducted in comparison with a Sunday or feast day D.L. Would there be any comparison to a low Mass that the Latin rites used? Incense? Fully chanted?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458 |
There should be no differences. The UGCC parish I belong to now that I live in Buffalo does not use incense or much chanting during the daily Liturgies. Some of the UGCC parishes here do not even use incense or chanting on Sundays for that matter!
So there is still a trend of having a "low mass."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,309 Likes: 3
Member
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 7,309 Likes: 3 |
Weekday Divine Liturgies are identical to Sunday ones, with the exception of the Antiphons, the Troparia and the Kontakia, which are proper to the day. Many priests will skip the homily on weekdays (unless it is also a feast), especially if there are only one or two people in the congregation, but his is an abuse and should be avoided. At the very least, a few words off the cuff on the readings, or the saint of the day would be appropriate.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 288
Member
|
Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 288 |
Dear Stuart,
I thought that daily DL's were not common practice, if practed at all, in the east. So, has the east always practiced daily DL's or has this been a new thing since the reunion with the west?
Kyrie eleison,
Manuel
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337 Likes: 24
Moderator Member
|
Moderator Member
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337 Likes: 24 |
Daily and Weekday Divine Liturgies are seperate issues. The Roman Church has one day, Good Friday, on which no Divine Liturgy is allowed. The Byzantine Church has many such days due to the several fasting periods throughout the year. That said nothing prohibits a Divine Liturgy from being celebrated on a weekday on which it is not forbidden. Daily Liturgies were simply not common outside of cathedrals/monasteries in the East.
My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337 Likes: 24
Moderator Member
|
Moderator Member
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337 Likes: 24 |
Just out of my curiosity, and our parish does not have daily D.L. How is a daily divine liturgy conducted in comparison with a Sunday or feast day D.L. Would there be any comparison to a low Mass that the Latin rites used? Incense? Fully chanted? The Ordo allows a Liturgy with Simple Rite which basically allows incense to be dispensed with and allows the priest to stay at the altar for the Epistle reading rather than going to the apsidal throne. These are the only differences officially sanctioned and it is fully expected that everything be chanted. In practice, however, reciting the Liturgy is not uncommon on weekdays, especially among Ukrainians.
My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 668 Likes: 1
Member
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 668 Likes: 1 |
Just out of my curiosity, and our parish does not have daily D.L. How is a daily divine liturgy conducted in comparison with a Sunday or feast day D.L. Would there be any comparison to a low Mass that the Latin rites used? Incense? Fully chanted? We usually have a weekday liturgy twice a week, in the morning at 8am. We always sing the entire liturgy, just as on Sunday, even though we are usually only 1-3 people. As Stuart noted, the antiphons are normally the weekday ones, and the troparia and kontakia proper to the day are sung. Our priest usually does give a homily on the weekdays, although occasionally he'll skip it. He normally omits the incense, however, at regular weekday liturgies (meaning non-feast days). And we don't do an opening hymn on the weekdays because he's not doing the incensation of the icons/church. Our church is Ruthenian.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 802 Likes: 2
Member
|
Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 802 Likes: 2 |
I was thinking about that question!
But how do chanted liturgies without choir in places people do not sing?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 668 Likes: 1
Member
|
Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 668 Likes: 1 |
I was thinking about that question!
But how do chanted liturgies without choir in places people do not sing? I don't know  We're a fairly small parish (1-3 at a weekday liturgy, 10-20 on a feastday, 60-85 on a Sunday), but we have a real strong tradition of everyone joining in the singing, even on all the propers. I think someone once told me that's typical of the Ruthenian tradtion, but I don't know. We don't have a choir, just a cantor on Sundays and sometimes for feast days, and then I usually cantor the weekdays and whatever feast days our main cantor is not able to do. On the weekdays if I can't make it, then our priest helps the 1-2 people there with the singing if they have trouble. Actually, now I'm remembering that one of those people told me that when I'm not there, they sing the non-changeable parts, but just recite the propers of the day (troparion, kontakion, etc).
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 252
Member
|
Member
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 252 |
Quote: "There should be no differences. The UGCC parish I belong to now that I live in Buffalo does not use incense or much chanting during the daily Liturgies. Some of the UGCC parishes here do not even use incense or chanting on Sundays for that matter!
So there is still a trend of having a "low mass."
Maybe you should send your pastor a package of incense and tell him to start using it. With a note stating "Your a Ukrainian Catholic and this is part of our tradition." If he is over 60, tell him that is the new trend. He He!!
Last edited by bkovacs; 08/24/10 02:22 AM.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458 |
This is actually the most liturgically correct parish around, at least on Sunday. I do not even think we should have weekday liturgies, they are very poorly attended, if at all. I think the weekday liturgies are based mainly on his family and Hispanic culture.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 139
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 139 |
off topic, but is your priest married with a large family? His name escapes me due to ever-more-frequent 'senior moments', but at a retreat in 2008 we had a UGCC priest come to our retreat center with his children (who cantored the service) and portable iconostasis to serve Vespers with Divine Liturgy for us, as our retreat master was not arriving until the following day. This priest is Hispanic.
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 403
Member
|
Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 403 |
I think the priest that you are speaking about is Father Robert Moreno, a priest of the Ukrainian Catholic Eparchy of Stamford who is stationed at a Ukrainian Catholic parish in Western New York. I have had the joy of meeting Father and his wife and children. They are a beautiful family and Father is a very noble and good priest.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 458 |
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 787
Member
|
Member
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 787 |
We usually have a weekday liturgy twice a week, in the morning at 8am. We always sing the entire liturgy, just as on Sunday, even though we are usually only 1-3 people. As Stuart noted, the antiphons are normally the weekday ones, and the troparia and kontakia proper to the day are sung. Our priest usually does give a homily on the weekdays, although occasionally he'll skip it. He normally omits the incense, however, at regular weekday liturgies (meaning non-feast days). And we don't do an opening hymn on the weekdays because he's not doing the incensation of the icons/church. Our church is Ruthenian. An opening hymn? What do you mean by that exactly? In the Orthodox Church we use incense whenever it is called for at the services of Vespers, Matins, and the Divine Liturgy. It is not optional. Fr David Straut
|
|
|
|
|