www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West What does it mean to be "Western" spiritually?

Many time I've read that Eastern folks need to stay eastern and Western need to stay western and not hybridize.
But what concerns me is what does (authentic) Western Catholic spirituality look like? What is a western mindset vs an eastern one? I understand the juridical aspect sometimes applied to the western thought process -- but what else defines it?
I guess I am trying to figure out what is my western patrimony?

-- Ignore this post -- I got some good answers on CAF....

Dave,
I'd love to see the responses you got. Could you PM me the link to the CAF thread?

Thanks,
Lawrence

I'd actually like to ask the opposite. As I have begun my journey East, I wonder where do I have to be to be Eastern in spirituality.

Admittedly I may end as one of those hybrids, given I was born and raised RC. But how to I gain that Eastern spirituality to begin with? (should I start another thread?)

Dave if you got some good answers from CAF you are pretty lucky. I have stopped reading the Eastern Catholic forum on CAF because of the advanced state of ignorance displayed by most of the people who post there. My favorite was one where the poster said she was in the process of moving to an Eastern Catholic parish and wanted to know if anyone had a good book to read on what Eastern Catholics believed. As she said there are "minor" differences between what Eastern Catholics and Latin Catholics believe. Or to quote another poster explaining Eastern Catholic theology, "They are Catholic not Orthodox."

Or as another insightful soul said "Byzcath.org is NOT Catholic." I suggested the same could be said about Catholic.com since a lot of what floats around there has little or nothing to do with anything that would be recognizable as Roman Catholic.

We don't want to get in the business of bashing other fora. However, I won't disagree that the quality of responses posted there is far less than ideal and displays a decided lack of knowledge and understanding of Eastern Christianity, Catholic and Orthodox. If it were not for the valient efforts of a few EC and EO posters from here (e.g., Michael/Hesychios, Ghosty, Deacon Lance, Diak, DavidB, Aramis) who post there and try to correct the most egregious errors, it would be even worse. (Oriental Catholicism and Orthodoxy fares somewhat better, as there are a couple of 'regulars' there from the OC Communion who are very knowledgeable.)

Of course, on re-reading the thread title - CAF may actually be the place to get that question answered. If you substituted 'Eastern' for Western, it definitely would not be the place to ask it.


Without seeing the context of this comment and who said it, I can't completely disagree. If the poster was hoping to thereby disparage this site, he or she failed miserably because, in truth, ByzCath.org is not Catholic. The name is a bit misleading and traces to its origins as a principally Byzantine (read that as 'Ruthenian') site that has since evolved to become the only (integrated) Eastern Christian site online; integrated in the sense of bringing together Eastern and Oriental Christians - Catholic and Orthodox, as well as Latins and others with an interest in or love of the East. It's a place where all of those persons can educate and be educated, discuss, deliberate, debate, and pray.

Testimony to our diversity abounds: a Moderator staff that counts among its number both Eastern Orthodox and Latin Christians, as well as Ruthenian and Melkite Catholics; an Administrator staff that includes an Orthodox presbyter; and active, posting, members representing nearly every Eastern Catholic and Eastern Orthodox Church, as well as most Oriental Catholic and some Oriental Orthodox Churches, and Western Christians - Latin, Lutheran, and Episcopalian, among them. We host private fora for Ukrainian Greek-Catholic clergy, for a study program of the Antiochian Orthodox Church, and for deacons, deacon candidates, and their wives.

On a given day, one can read posts from: a Ukrainian Greek-Catholic priest in Ireland; Russian Orthodox priests from Japan, NJ, the Midwest, UK, or NZ; Melkite deacons from Australia or CA; a Lutheran pastor; a retired Episcopalian priest of Ruthenian ancestry; a Melkite priest serving a Russian Catholic parish in NYC; a Latin Catholic journalist in Portugal; cantors and iconographers, deacons and subdeacons, and just plain men and women, from myriad Churches, from every continent except Antarctica, and from more countries than I can remember anymore. In short, this fora represents and is a place for the gathering of God's people to celebrate the faith that originated in the East and of which we now proclaim witness to the world beyond.

Many years,

Neil

The full quote was "Byzcath is NOT a Catholic site, but I would recommend people see for themselves how little regard the mods and posters there have for the teachings of the Catholic Church."

Decidedly NOT my experience here.


Exactly so, and I value that so much.

CAF serves a very different function from Byzcath Forum since it has a great many Latin Catholics who wouldn't want to be here, and are sometimes a great challenge to us on CAF but also who sometimes are genuine in their desire to learn more (about the Eastern and Oriental Churches, and about the Latin Church). It's a very high profile site being advertised a great deal on Catholic radio.

A very distinct benefit here is the number of clergy active here. We do have a few Catholic and Orthodox clergy including Oriental as you mentioned, on CAF but they're not nearly as many nor as active as here.

I've asked some pretty clueless questions both places and been given due respect in both.

Since a complaint we often have there is that threads so quickly careen off topic, I hesitate to be one to do that here.

Ah, thank you, MaryLouise. Seeing now who made the statement (in reply to a recommendation that someone come here to inquire as to the theological differences between Eastern and Western Catholics), I know that the intent was to disparage us. The poster in question, in fact, followed it up with the observation that ByzCath even had Orthodox moderators!

The shame of it all!

If he ever reads my post above, we can likely anticipate that he'll petition to Rome for an interdict to be placed against our server and myself to be declared anathema. Ah well, ...

Many years,

Neil

Constantine,

Yes, it would probably be better if you did. This one has begun to have too many curves in it (at least one carved out by me) and may need closing.

Many years,

Neil

Neil-I wouldn't be so quick to judge the poster. We have some posters here who are known to make some "offending" statements. The poster has experience with our Eastern Catholic Churches and is more typically speaking favorably. I believe he/she has identified as traditional Catholic. While we can get some nasty bullies from that group this poster is not at all one of those in my experience. It has seemed to me that he/she is one who has experienced the ECCs over years and appreciates us.

You do a fabulous job moderating here, Neil. I'm sure that comment stung. The relationship we ECs have with Orthodox is often something not understood by Latin Catholics, indeed I often find we make no sense to our Orthodox. We are in a very odd position... I'm very grateful to have Bycath as an important part of living out that odd position.

MaryLouise,

I know the poster - I have no illusions as to the nature of his opinion. And, no, the comment didn't sting at all - the only thing coming out of there that stings is the incredible amount of misinformation about our Churches, Catholic and Orthodox, with which people walk away because there aren't enough knowledgeable folk there to counter it.

I know what we have here and what they have there (where I moderated that site's 'Eastern Christian' predecessor forum, under another nick, for several years). I'm more than proud of our mod staff and members, EC/OC, EO/OO, Latin, Lutheran, Episcopal, (as well as a few others), clergy and lay - even those who occasionally offend.

Many years,

Neil