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Stuart K,

I can see why you would disagree with Canon 897. Its wording doesn't make room for those who identify themselves as "Orthodox in communion with Rome".

When an Eastern, Oriental, or Assyrian Christian enters the Catholic Church, the canon states he/she makes a profession of the Catholic faith.

Even if that is ignored at the parish level doesn't make the canon unimportant or irrelevant.

The fact that it states "after doctrinal preparation" implies there are differences between the Catholic faith and the faith of the non-Catholic Eastern Churches.

Don't shoot the messenger. I am only stating what's in Eastern Catholic canon law.

God bless,
GC

A good friend of mine is a Roman Catholic priest, and has occasion to receive people from the Christian East (from Churches not in communion with Rome). He first ascertains their desire is legitimate and personal (i.e., a spouse is not compelling the person). Then he tells they can stay in their current Church and simply join the parish (though the bishops of the Eastern Church would not sanction it). Then he suggests they might wish to become Eastern Catholic. Should they then indicate that, yes, they wish to join the Roman Catholic parish he signs them up as members. He then asks about their spiritual status (have they made a good confession recently). And that's it.

Ryan's experience (above) is fairly typical. Though I know of examples that were even less formal (as I noted earlier, the taking of parish envelopes is often the outward sign of full communion!).

And this level of oikonomia does flow in both directions. I have an acquaintance from college who was raised Greek Catholic, and who settled in Washington, DC, living near St. Nicholas Cathedral (OCA). He simply joined the parish and has been a regular member there for 25 years. [Of course, he is a Slav, and to most Slavs any building with a three bar cross on top is home.]

Well, I don't know about that extra stuff that GC mentioned. I don't have a copy of the rite. Is this entire affirmation found in the rite used in the Eastern Churches or is this for the Latin rite too?

I have been on the teaching team for RCIA in my parish since 2005, and we have traditionally received Protestants at the Easter Vigil with those who are being baptized.
The form in which I posted, previously, is the only affirmation of faith that we have ever used. This does not make me an expert, by any means. But, this is the first time I've seen this anywhere.

The Orthodox are Catholic, and the Orthodox faith is the Catholic faith. Your mistake is thinking the Roman faith is the Catholic faith--it's only a subset thereof, and has no particular priority over any other Tradition.

Also, I was none of those things. I was a catechumen, and was baptized a Byzantine Catholic. I have had the opportunity to observe a number of other adult catechumens baptized since joining the Melkite Church (why they should get so many, while the Ruthenians do not, ought to be a matter of concern to the latter), and their rite of initiation is identical to mine.

Amen!

If you're a Melkite or Ukrainian bishop, then this is your escape clause, because they do not recognize any doctrinal separation between the Orthodox and Greek Catholic Churches. When my Patriarch tells me he is an Orthodox Christian, I guess that means he sees no doctrinal distinction between being Orthodox and being Greek Catholic. He signed the Zoghby Statement, which says, "I believe everything the Orthodox Church believes". Not too much room for doctrinal separation, I would say.

And if you see doctrinal separation between your Church and its Orthodox Mother Church, then your Church is doing something wrong.

AMEN!

Amen.

If I felt this were the case I would still be Orthodox. The fact is the Orthodox are not in union with Rome. In my mind they are not fully Catholic. While Catholics believe all that the Orthodox believe, they are in union with Rome and believe all that she does also. That's a big leap! Amen.

Since it has been mentioned that there are parishes that do not require a profession of faith as stated in Canon 897, then it really shouldn't surprise us if there are other parishes that may add a little bit extra.

Well, the EOC doesn't see it that way or they would allow intercommunion in all cases. The EOC doesn't see you as the same.

Doesn't matter what the Eastern Orthodox Churches think, because we're not discussing an Eastern Orthodox canon. And I suspect that most Eastern Orthodox theologians don't see any doctrinal differences between the Greek Catholics and the Eastern Orthodox, but rather differences in ecclesiastical governance.

My former Melkite eparch, Bishop John Elya, certainly believes there is a difference:
and
and


Yet, your own "Orthodox Mother Church" doesn't regard you as Orthodox.

Retired Bishop Elya is entitlted to his own opinion on theological matters, but I do not believe that Melkites are required to agree with him.

For example he has said: "To admit that one is homosexual -- 'God created me that way' -- is a statement of fact which should not offend adult people who discuss issues and not persons." Clearly he believes what he wrote to be true, seeing that he publicly posted that position as his own, but I am not obliged to agree with him.

Now as far as primacy is concerned, I accept the position taken by the Melkite Holy Synod in 1995/1996, and hold that the Bishop of Rome is the first among equals according to the limits recognized by the Holy Fathers of the first millennium. Moreover, my faith, like that of the Melkite Church as a whole, is the same as that of the Eastern Orthodox, which of course was (and remains to this day) the position affirmed by the Holy Synod when it issued the so-called Zoghby Initiative.

Yet, the Antiochian Orthodox Church doesn't see you as Orthodox. I don't understand how one can say he or she is "Orthodox in communion with Rome" when the Holy See and the "Mother Orthodox Church" say such a thing is not possible.

One may choose to ignore them and live as if it were possible to be OICWR, but eventually they face the reality of it and find it very difficult. I am talking from personal experience. People in my parish who identified themselves as OICWR eventually left and joined the Orthodox Church.