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Dec 29th, 2019
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Joined: Jul 2005
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I thought that this man was excommunicated by Archbishop Husar, but perhaps I am wrong.
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Joined: Apr 2005
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Sometimes groups of the faithful have to stand up for what they believe in.
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They really shouldn't use the term "Orthodox" in their English title (even if they don't capitalize it) since they are not even trying to be Orthodox. "Ukrainian Right-Believing Greek Catholic Church" would probably be a better translation.
Dn. David
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They really shouldn't use the term "Orthodox" in their English title (even if they don't capitalize it) since they are not even trying to be Orthodox. "Ukrainian Right-Believing Greek Catholic Church" would probably be a better translation.
Dn. David Did anyone else try to view their videos? To be polite, I thought that they were weird - neither Catholic - Eastern or Western, nor Orthodox. When you consider the range of how Ukrainian Greek Catholics view the externals of their Church you find an incredible span. It can range from St. Elias in Ontario to these folks and beyond.
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This sounds like a Ukrainian version of the SSPX? If it is in due time the excommunication will be lifted and they will spend their time spouting "tradition Catholic" slander while confusing the world and the faithful.
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Did anyone else try to view their videos? To be polite, I thought that they were weird - neither Catholic - Eastern or Western, nor Orthodox. They are weird, but there's a lot of weird in the RCC too. It seems like you can get away with a lot of weird (including ignoring church teaching) if you don't challenge the hierarchy. That it would seem led to their excommunication.
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Praised be Jesus Christ!
Yes, they are somewhat strange in some of their views, but God bless them for being man enough to stand up against the apostasy/religious indifference which the Vatican has promoted many times, if not in words, in actions-the worst being allowing pagans to worship their deities in Catholic Churches in Assisi under Pope John Paul II.I saw it, it happened.They are basically saying the same thing as the SSPX, ROCOR, the Synod in Resistance, etc...Fr. Seraphim Rose was right about the modern hierarchs falling to the spirit of the world, as Metropolitan Sergius capitulated to the Soviets.
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This sounds like a Ukrainian version of the SSPX? If it is in due time the excommunication will be lifted and they will spend their time spouting "tradition Catholic" slander while confusing the world and the faithful. It is the Ukrainian version of the SSPX. The go far to accept that Latinizations are legit and binding on Eastern Catholics.
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This is the whole problem with the top down approach. If these people feel that Latinizations are part of their traditions and they've come to accept them, who is to tell them or force them in to accepting they aren't? Wouldn't that conceivably take generations of slow and gradual change?
You can't push the reset button on people, or they will react.
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This is the whole problem with the top down approach. If these people feel that Latinizations are part of their traditions and they've come to accept them, who is to tell them or force them in to accepting they aren't? Wouldn't that conceivably take generations of slow and gradual change?
You can't push the reset button on people, or they will react. Indeed, that was why the approach that Archbishop, later Patriarch Athenagoras of thrice blessed, saintly memory wisely urged the Phanar to adopt when receiving Father, later Metropolitan Orestes of thrice-blessed, saintly memory and the faithful of what became ACROD differed dramatically from the approach used in the past when receiving converts from Eastern Catholicism by other Orthodox jurisdictions. Changes came gradually over decades and a distinction between what was legitimately 'Orthodox' within the 'Ruthenian' tradition and what was a really a western import became better understood within ACROD and the Orthodox Church as a whole. Many scoffed at the Greeks for taking this approach, but in the long run I believe that it has proven to be the correct path.
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While I agree wholeheartedly with my friend and brother, David, as regards the wisdom of the approach taken when what is now ACROD was received into Holy Orthodoxy, I can't hold out much hope that taking anything other than a hard-line approach with this group will work.
Like the Society of St Josaphat (the SSPX group), these folk are another collection of latinizers, the only real difference being that they originate from within as opposed to without the UGCC.
They would create some hybrid ecclesial phenomena initially neither Eastern nor Western, but - in the end - it can almost be guaranteed that there would be few, if any, remaining vestiges of Byzantine spirituality or praxis. If they want to be Latin, have at it - ask for a transfer of enrollment and go. But, don't try to undermine our Churches on the basis that what has transpired through decades of suppression constitutes some new, better, entity and defend it as organic development.
Many years,
Neil
"One day all our ethnic traits ... will have disappeared. Time itself is seeing to this. And so we can not think of our communities as ethnic parishes, ... unless we wish to assure the death of our community."
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Why does it have to be all or nothing?
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While I agree wholeheartedly with my friend and brother, David, as regards the wisdom of the approach taken when what is now ACROD was received into Holy Orthodoxy, I can't hold out much hope that taking anything other than a hard-line approach with this group will work.
Like the Society of St Josaphat (the SSPX group), these folk are another collection of latinizers, the only real difference being that they originate from within as opposed to without the UGCC.
They would create some hybrid ecclesial phenomena initially neither Eastern nor Western, but - in the end - it can almost be guaranteed that there would be few, if any, remaining vestiges of Byzantine spirituality or praxis. If they want to be Latin, have at it - ask for a transfer of enrollment and go. But, don't try to undermine our Churches on the basis that what has transpired through decades of suppression constitutes some new, better, entity and defend it as organic development.
Many years,
Neil Welcome back! I just wanted to clarify that I was only offering an opinion on the comment: 'You can't push the reset button on people, or they will react.'I don't see this group, with whatever support they may or may not have being received and assimilated as they are. They almost appeared to be mimicking TV evangelist modes.
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