www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Desecration of Saint Andrew's, Los Angeles, CA

This is the sad story about the recent desecration of Saint Andrew's Ukrainian Orthodox Church in Los Angeles. I have no words except to say: Lord, have mercy. http://www.uocofusa.org/news_110820_1.html

Here is the parish website.
http://www.saintandrewla.com/

http://you-are-here.com/sunset/orthodox.html

Please keep the pastor and members in your prayers.

Ray

Hospodi Pomiluj (x40)

In the last two weeks, there were two major thefts in Cleveland area churches. One was at Trinity Episcopal Cathedral in which sacred objects and treasures worth $87,000 were stolen and the other was at Holy Name Catholic Church where a whole tabernacle and chalices containing the Holy Eucharist were taken. One of the bishops of the Catholic Diocese of Cleveland will offer a Mass of Reparation at Holy Name Church.

http://www.wkyc.com/news/article/202568/3/Theft-of-80000-in-items-from-Cleveland-cathedral

http://www.woio.com/story/15296325/sinners-steal-from-another-church

With the price of gold rising, thieves are becoming bolder and more desparate. Please pray for these churches and their members.

Christ is in our midst!!

Sadly, it seems churches need to think of better security in this day and age.

I read the theft pieces in Cleveland and thought of an ad for a gun safe from a sporting magazine. The thing is about the size of a refrigerator and has extra thick steel walls and door. It's fireproof and supposedly burglar-proof.

www.cabelas.com/gun-safes.shtml [cabelas.com]

Outside doors need to be heavier, too. It's interesting to me the type of exterior door placed on church buildings these days. Older churches throughout PA that I have served in had sold oak exterior doors that open outward and an immediate inner door that, together, give about six inches of solid material between the outside world and the church. Why modern churches have doors that people can see through or that are more artistic than protective is beyond me. In the days when these fortress doors were installed, people respected churches. Today when no one respects either people or property we have invitation doors that provide no security.

It's even worse when the Holy Gifts are desecrated. All the other articles can be replaced because they are material. But the offense to Our Lord is something that ought to cause us all to shudder, though it is not the fault of believers. Woe to the one who did that on the Great Day.

In Christ,

Bob

Prayers for Father Vasyl and the parishioners of St Andrew's, as well as the clergy and parishioners of Trinity Cathedral and Holy Name in Cleveland.

As one of those responsible for security of the Melkite Cathedral for the past four decades, I agree with Bob's observations.

Regretably, the unlocked churches of my own childhood are a thing of the past. But even locks alone are no longer adequate.

Alarm systems and well-thought out plans that compartmentalize sections of a complex - limiting how far an intruder can penetrate once inside - present inconveniences with which one must live these days. The nusciance to those who must lock and unlock, in the course of legitimately moving through the building, is the price we pay for living in a society beset by persons with no respect, even for the sacred.

Many years,

Neil

I agree with you, Bob, about the need for better church security. In fact,

1.) My parish and others already own and use large (room- high), burglar-proof safes. We also have and use diocese-mandated, burglar-proof, sealed Sunday collection bags which are put in the locked safe after each Sunday Mass. They are counted on Mondays by rotating, member-shuffled counting teams.

2.) We keep the church closed and locked until 30 minutes before and then closed and locked again 30 minutes after each daily Mass. On Sundays, the ushers and welcomers greet and observe members and guests between Masses.

3.) Every evening, either a parishioner or one of our priests walks through the entire church and checks every restroom, confessional, closet, and even the walkway in the roof for unwanted intruders. Yes, we found a homeless person up there one evening. Finally, the locks on the outside doors are tested.

Nevertheless, we have had thefts of money from purses (during Communion) and even candle and poor boxes. Also, we have had cars stolen from our parking lot and in front of our church. Now, we have city police cruise by and patrol the church areas at different times. Nothing - however large or small - is really safe from determined thieves, but we are ever vigilant and try to make it as hard as possible for them.

I recommended to my parish that we consider ADT-type property alarm systems; but I was informed that for our size church and other buildings (school), it is too expensive. However, we have theft, fire, storm, and other insurance. And, we discuss with the diocese, police, insurance agents, social workers, parishioners, and community what we can do to make our church safer. Above all, we pray for everyone's safety and salvation.

My prayers are added also

Unworthy Kolya

Christ is in our midst!!

It seems to me that, at a minimum, sacristies need to be made far more secure. That may be more of a problem for Eastern churches that leave sacred vessels on the altar or prosthesis table, but we live in a different age than when it was safe to leave things out.

As far as security goes, in some areas churches hire auxilliary or off-duty police to wander through theri parking areas during Sunday services--not a cheap thing, but often necessary. A few years ago cars were broken into at my daughter's church and laptops were stolen.

As far as purses go, the days when one could leave anything of value in the pew when one approached the Holy Gifts is also over, even n rural areas like mine. That was one very new thing I learned when we lived outside Philadelphia 30 years ago, but it was a valuable lesson.

In my own parish, we have a program where companies provide us with discount cards to help our school's financing. During Liturgy, someone made off with between 4 and 7 thousand dollars worth. So even trusting members is often a thing of the past.

We've got to stop thinking that a sense of the sacred will deter. For many it isn't part of their experinece or thinking.

Some years ago, I was asked to design a new sacrarium for our parish. I was told that there were problems with people entering the building, stopping up sinks, and turning on the water. So my design put the whole double sink/sacrarium inside a locked cabinet that we had built and installed.

I don't know what elements should be included in church design, but it seems to me that security is so often not given much thought. And from the examples shown above, it seems to me security needs to be primary or close to it.

Bob

I cannot imagine the pain, hurt and defilement that this congregation must feel after this horrible event. It is probably the same emotions felt after your house gets robbed. This was pretty nasty: the Altar physically moved, the Blessed Sacrament on the floor etc. Let us pray for the pastor and good people of Saint Andrew's, and also that the burglers repent and come forward.

Ray

Unspeakable. For once even I am floored.

I understand several of the Latin parishes in N. Tex. are using the gun safes as described in an earlier post.

I read that during the Communist period in Albania, in an anti-religion museum, consecrated Hosts in a ciborium were on display as an example of the incompatability of religion with science, or materialism, or some such reason...but it was really just gratuituous sacrilige.

Holy Things to the...what?! UNholy?

Lord, have mercy.

Maybe a return to using the Skevophylakion is in order. Once upon a time, none of the sacred vessels or objects were kept in the temple. This is not the first time in the history of the Church we have had to deal with an un-saved, unruly society, and examining what was done in prior generations is in order. If i understand correctly, even the rise of many of the minor orders came about by such necessities as we are seeing here.

As Bob pointed out, even my home church has massive doouble doors (dating to the 1880s) that even have a bronze peice on one of each of the pair that overlaps so that you cannot pry in between the gap in the middle. Also the doors latch at the top and bottom, and this all within 15 foot high walls! An extreme example, but what are we willing to do to protect what is dear to us? Even with all that-a thief or satanically oriented person of enough determination will not be deterred or thwarted for long. And closing the churches doesn't do much for helping spread the Gospel-it isn't much for sitting back in fear behind locked doors, but rather quite the opposite.

In Christ,
Adam

Gospodi pomilui!

The Sacred Chrism was stolen from my Latin parish about a month ago. The Oil for the Sick, and Oil for the Catechumens in the same cabinet was not taken. All the vessels are in a safe behind a locked door. Our oils are in the Church which is open all day, a blessing for the many who stop in during the day. We've gotten a new locked cabinet and ordered a new set of vessels for the oils. The fact it was only the Sacred Chrism that was stolen is disturbing. Thankfully Father has not at this point decided to lock up the church after daily 8AM Mass. I go in whenever I'm out doing errands and I'm never the only person in there praying.

The brass hand railings for the stairs leading to the front door at Holy Trinity Russian Orthodox here in SF were stolen a while back. Back in 1999 their bells were stolen [russianbells.com], but luckily returned.

None of this remotely compares with the desecration at Saint Andrew's. We can speculate something sinister has happened with the Sacred Chrism from my church.

Cleveland police arrested a man suspected of stealing sacred objects from a local church and recovered some of the church property after the accused tried to sell it for scrap.

http://www.woio.com/story/15311895/police-nab-man-in-church-theft

No news yet about the Communion hosts.

The thing that surprises me is that the desecration of the church wasn't reported anywhere I could find in the local LA papers. For all the lack of interest not to say hostility to religious events among the general public, I do think that people are still shocked when churches are desecrated like that.

Perhaps if more people were aware of it, the perpetrators could be found.