www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall What kind of Catholic Voter are you? Joe Biden or Paul Ryan?

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/44/2010/03/white-house-announces-executiv.html


and finally what an executive order looks like from a liar of a so called president

"Obama signed the Senate health care bill into law Tuesday. He did not sign the executive order on abortion negotiated with Michigan Democratic Congressman Bart Stupak in an 11th-hour arrangement that may well have saved the entire health care reform effort.

A White House official told Fox, Obama will not sign the Executive Order Tuesday and has set no specific date to do so. Stupak predicted Obama would sign the order later this week. The White House said only that Obama would sign the order “soon.”

In two celebratory speeches Tuesday – one at the bill’s signing, the other at the Interior Department with health care advocates – Obama said nothing about the abortion issue or the executive order"

Fox news website around the time of the signing of the fiasco called Obamacare



EXECUTIVE ORDER NEVER SIGNED !!!!!!

OBAMA LIES AGAIN !!!!!!

HHS MANDATE THAT ALL CATHOLIC INSTITUTIONS MUST PROVIDE ABORTIONS FOR ALL EMPLOYED WHO MENSTRUATE!

These are the cold blooded killer facts baby

Romney nailed it at the Republican Convention with “If you felt excitement when you voted for Barack Obama, shouldn’t you feel that way about President Obama?”

I am so tired of this very tired so called President

Tired of the malaise
Tired of the divisiveness
Tired of the depressive Democratic Platform where he tell Americans how they are not as good as he is because they don't want to pay taxes
Tired of the lies
Tired of the attacks and smears on anyone who opposes the almighty who promised the waters would stop rising
Tired of SOCIALISM

I JUST DAMNED TIRED.

I want to get to an America where we build each other up and help each other
Where RICH people can give POOR people JOBS!

And where we can start calling Abortion what it really is

Abortion is killing babies -

The President should say "I am in support of women killing their babies"

He should say "I want Catholics to help their workers KILL BABIES"

I have so far avoided this mud slinging contest because this conversation is showing the worst of the political season. Claiming to know what is in someone's heart is absurd. John, I know this is a very emotional topic for you and I admire that passion, but I have a very hard time taking you seriously because you just spit our whatever comes to mind.

We are all aware of the consequences and the gratuitous act of abortion. I am as against abortion as someone can be, but the craziness that people speak and the crazy way the act make me shy away from anything labeled "pro-life" because is is always "anti-this," anti-that."

I think we, as Christians, should lead with example this election season, and everyday, to stop condemning others (e.g. "they are responsible" because we are responsible for electing them) and maybe show some compassion.

Just a closing though, how culpable are we all in this situation? How many of our senators and representatives vote for bills and budgets that contain funding for abortions or organizations that provide abortions? I would guess (I would love for someone to prove me wrong, and I'm being serious about it) that every elected representative has voted for a measure that provides money to some organization that provides for abortions.

Get real Erie Byz

Stupak is an astute politician and was looking for an out.

He sold his soul to the devil

If you vote for Obama you may be selling your soul.

I'm not mud slinging

I'm tired of pussy footing around the issues

ABORTION IS MURDER 99.999999% OF THE TIME

I want to deliver a profound Amen! to your post, Erie-Byz. Harsh, wild-eyed language has no place in civil discourse. But that appears to be on a steep decline in America. *Praying for the health of this republic*

As we all agree on Civil discourse ... there are many many abortions occuring everyday in this "civil" society

so pat yourselves on the back all you want -

Civli discourse is when Catholics who cannot defend their vote for an abortionist must use this so called civil discourse to justify their choice against all catholic teaching and all moral obligations of a true christian - of which I personally fall short

I apologize for my demeanor tonight - but the more I hear about how people justify and ignore the abortion issues and the HHS attack on the Catholic Church - DE MEANER I GET!

Paul B, God bless you and thank you for providing civil tone to this discourse.

It is literally impossible to separate human life from the environment. We humans are intimately interconnected to the health of the natural ecosystems, which we Christians rightly refer to as God's Creation. Hold your breath and see if you can survive without oxygen intake? You can't, of course, sir. When we degrade the ecosystems, we degrade our lives.

In my humble opinion, destroying the environment is a form of suicide, which is a grave moral sin is it not?

Is that not one of the fatal flaws in today's society- thinking that we can master nature and become, even supersede, God? Arrogance/greed, excessive wants over regular needs, and rampant soulless materialism are destroying the fabric of this republic and the souls of her inhabitants. There is a horrific deficit of spiritual health and well-being, which of course we could attribute to a lack of faith in Almighty God.

The GOP is not a pro-life party. There is more to the Pro-Life agenda then just abortion (which, do not misunderstand me in any way, is a grave moral sin and outrage). The GOP leads vicious assaults on the environment and cuts holes in the safety net for the poor and needy, while ensuring that tax rates are slashed even more for the richest among us. That absolutely flies in the face of Christ's message of love, just as abortion does.

If Catholics also choose to remain within the GOP, it would be nice to see you good folks try to change its policies to reflect a more full-spectrum Pro-Life agenda. God bless to you, and may all dialogue occur with dignity and respect.

BenjaminRH

There is more to Pro Life agenda than Abortion?

You've had way too much KOOL AID

Well said BenjaminRH. Welcome to the forum...I've been down this road many times...Pro-life is pro-all life...not just pro-in utero life...hope you are able to take the sh*t that now gets thrown at you...many of the conservatives...you will quickly find out, if you haven't already are more prone to lie and use ad-hominem attacks when they can't defend their position...Stay strong my friend...

This calls for reflection and prayer. Are we truly "destroying" God's creation? The comparison to suicide is wrong. Maybe there are times when we abuse the environment, but DESTROYING? Some would claim that even sewage plants abuse the environment because during heavy rains they legally discharge the wastes from the holding tanks.


Yes! This truly is the thinking of the many environmentalists! Many of them think we have to reduce the human population through whatever means necessary to "save" the earth. They are not beliievers that God has created the earth with natural laws which eventually balance nature.


Compared to many in the world and throughout history, is not even the poorest among us rich in possessions and services?
At what point does a safety net become a crutch and an excuse not to work?

I have to leave this forum for a couple days, I'm going to "otpust." I will remember our nation and those in the forum when I concelebrate the Perpetual Help Akathist.

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Stay strong and avoid that issue ... no matter what

Avoid the truth

Run away from your obligation as a Christian

THOU SHALT NOT KILL!

You are your brothers keeper my friend.

All your justifications may be paving your road to hell.

I know I have my own way to hell paved (all by myself) but at least I know Abortion is murder.

Let's keep this simple ... I don't want to talk about whales and fish, trees and watersheds

I want to address ABORTION plain and simple.

oh and by the way - a civil discourse is not alluding to another in fear that you will be out debated on a topic by ME!

I own you on this abortion issue if you say your Catholic or Orthodox - My position is the position of the church even though many of our Bishops don't have the courage to preach and teach in fear of losing their precious weekly donations.

My statements are emotional and provocative and designed to get some kind of reasonable response - which I fear is out of the question for over 65% of Roman Catholics who justify supporting a president (little p) who promotes abortion and infringes upon the rights of the very church they belong to.

MY argument is falling on deaf ears - I am having trouble controlling my postings oriented toward a COMMON GROUND MENTALITIY that Obama so cleverly used to trick Catholics into voting for him - A COMMON GROUND that is no common ground ... just defeat and death - death to children - death the the Latin Rite Catholic Institutions - so I will quit - this is my last post - I will leave you to your environmental diversion so that you can feel good about voting FOR ABORTION.

Please pray for me as I go and deal with my anger at my fellow catholics (little c) and for my own sin of passion, anger, and my inability to communicate without total frustration, anger and desperation for trying to save the lives of the unborn.

I am very very poor at this - and it's reached a point where I just want to scream at the top of my lungs to the world about the travesty that is now law - and ANTI CATHOLIC TO THE CORE

When it is fine with signing a covenant of death and a pact with hell, it is terminally ill.

God put these magnificent systems in motion for our benefit.

Dynomiting mountain tops, which leads to coal sludge polluting streams, is an act of destroying. Clearcutting the Amazon Rainforest is more than simple abuse. Holes in the Ozone Layer due to CFCs (which even Ronald Reagan took a noble stand against) is drastically frightening.


Well, people who claim to be conservatives have utterly abandoned the conservation and green movement to the Left. Conservation was a classical conservative position, as it should be again. Conservative Quotes (Provided by Co...publicans for Environmental Protection.) [conservamerica.org]

Perhaps if conservatives returned to their traditional roots, then there would be more respect for Nature/God's creation in the green movement.

God bless you and yours.

Of course, all of the things mentioned were more hype than reality. Stewardship based upon responsible use of the land always requires making tradeoffs concerning costs and benefits.

I would blow the tops off of a thousand mountaintops, if with the coal extracted thereby I could provide electricity to the one billion people alive today who live in abject squalor, prevented from bettering their lot by the absence of cheap and reliable electric power.

Environmentalism is and always has been a hobby of the rich, concerned more about "nature" and "the planet" in the abstract, than with the lives of real people affected by these policies. Ask the myriad coal workers affected by green policies how much better their lives are, now that they have no jobs. Ask the person living in a cardboard shack in Africa how much he appreciates that you will bring him a solar-electric array so he can charge the cell phone he doesn't have, while waiting for that coal-fired power plant that would bring him clean water, allow him to stop burning dung and chopping down trees for firewood (you want to talk about environmental impact? Look there), provide him with light and the potential for a better-paying industrial job that will finally end his poverty. People like that have no time for posturing about holes in the ozone layer that occur naturally and heal naturally, or about changes in climate that have been happening for billions of years, or quixotic attempts to turn back "climate change" by keeping that billion people in squalor and driving most other people back towards that state. I'm sure they'll thank you.

How's our ozone layer doing lately? We're capturing escaping gasoline fumes, changed refrigerants, etc. Have we made progress or were the experts wrong?

We have a local example of bureaucratic waste and nonsense. There are complaints of mosquitoes, so they set up their testing for West Nile virus potential. They found one potential mosquito, so they sprayed the area. This is happening in a re-constructed (at taxpayer and corporate expense) and protected wetlands; yet they are spraying and killing insects. Why, oh, why, don't they simply put up some bathouses to naturally eliminate mosquitoes without killing other insects, including bees?

Don't tell me that we should vote for these non-competents rather than pro-life people. They was much indignation in the 60's and 70's about the military-industrial complex. Now the "progressives" have legislated a government-subsidized, government-promoted environmental industrial complex.

PLEASE, quit wasting corn which could feed the world to make ethanol. Besides creating government subsidized distilleries the policy has reduced mpg and destroyed literally millions of small engines. If you want to talk about morality, how about this forced starvation result. Is there any legitimate reason we should mandate fuel with 10 per cent ethanol? Yet there is a vocal portion of the Obama administration who would like to INCREASE it to 15 per cent.