www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Vice Presdential Debate and the Catholic Vote

Which Catholic position do you take

Joe Biden - I'm Catholic - I do not want to interfere with someones right to murder their own baby.

Paul Ryan - I'm Catholic - I'm Pro Life - the Obama administration has a full on attack on Catholicism and Religious Freedom with Obamacare and the HHS Mandate to force a religion to provide abortion services to anyone who is able to menstruate.

Please talk about Religious Freedom - Abortion - the HHS mandate and how you are voting and why.

Please do not divert the topic to global warming, unjust warfare, catholic social justice, or any other talking points designed to divert from this very important decision (in fact a grave decision with implications for this life and the next)

If Biden were really a Catholic I'd be more concerned. What does trouble me is that he has not been officially excommunicated.

I think Paul Ryan definitely spelled it out to the letter yesterday when I was watching. His take on it brought a tear to my eye, to be sure. It just seems like your Bidens, Pelosies, and Kerries of the world want to tear down the truth about Catholic issues. It's best to follow your Ryans and Santorums of the world when it comes to being Pro-Life, and Pro Traditional Marriage.

Paul Ryan's response was mature and articulate. I love love LOVE that he accented SAFE! "Jolly Joe" Biden blew right past that. He responded to an imaginary convo inside his head, instead of what Paul Ryan *actually* said.

So few people understand that while abortion is legal, it is unregulated and most abortion mills unlicensed. The media's stout refusal to tell the public about the women who are harmed and even killed is shameful.

These people stand on their soapboxes and proclaim themselves as benefactors of women. I seriously doubt a single one of them has looked at the destructive force that is abortion.

Apropos the debate and Catholic issues: USCCB Responds To Inaccurate Statement [usccb.org] Of Fact On HHS Mandate Made During Vice Presidential Debate.

Well, that's why the GOP agenda is the lesser of two evils every time, and why most Pro-Life voting guides point towards the Republicans.

There are two major errors by the VP (in my opinion) that the fact checkers overlooked:

1. Biden's claim that the Romney/Ryan policy would make abortion illegal. I believe their goal is to overturn Roe V Wade so that abortion is not considered an unchallengeble and unregulated Consitutional "right."

2. On this point I am posting the USCCB ProLife Secretariat's comments:

Last night, the following statement was made during the Vice Presidential debate regarding the decision of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services (HHS) to force virtually all employers to include sterilization and contraception, including drugs that may cause abortion, in the health insurance coverage they provide their employees:

“With regard to the assault on the Catholic Church, let me make it absolutely clear. No religious institution—Catholic or otherwise, including Catholic social services, Georgetown hospital, Mercy hospital, any hospital—none has to either refer contraception, none has to pay for contraception, none has to be a vehicle to get contraception in any insurance policy they provide. That is a fact. That is a fact.”

This is not a fact. The HHS mandate contains a narrow, four-part exemption for certain “religious employers.” That exemption was made final in February and does not extend to “Catholic social services, Georgetown hospital, Mercy hospital, any hospital,” or any other religious charity that offers its services to all, regardless of the faith of those served.

HHS has proposed an additional “accommodation” for religious organizations like these, which HHS itself describes as “non-exempt.” That proposal does not even potentially relieve these organizations from the obligation “to pay for contraception” and “to be a vehicle to get contraception.” They will have to serve as a vehicle, because they will still be forced to provide their employees with health coverage, and that coverage will still have to include sterilization, contraception, and abortifacients. They will have to pay for these things, because the premiums that the organizations (and their employees) are required to pay will still be applied, along with other funds, to cover the cost of these drugs and surgeries.

I respect the office of Vice President of the United States regardless of the officeholder, but last night with his sneers and snarls, Joe Biden scandalized that office.

I respect the office of Vice President of the United States regardless of the officeholder, but last night with his sneers and snarls, Joe Biden scandalized that office.

Worth 1000 words:

http://treeofmamre.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/biden-a-fool-rages-and-laughs.jpg

Wholeheartedly agree. Joe Biden has to have better respect for his opponent than he did, it's only fair. He was anything but respectful to Paul Ryan at all throughout most of the debate. Ryan should have had more time to drive his points home, imo. It was just bad, biased moderation of the debate was what it was.

I completely disagree with characterizing the debate between Ryan and Vice-President Biden as a conversation between a wise man and a fool. Biden might well be a fool, but Ryan is no wise man.

Well, we shall soon see how well the debates between Romney and Obama go throughout the next couple of weeks. We shall keep close eyes on their debates, and see how wide the poll gaps are between the two by the time Election Day itself comes about.

Following Christ (Orthodox, Catholic, or Protestant) is not about one issue, unless that issue is Christ himself. Being President or VP requires competence in many areas (like being able to know the difference between a voucher and a payment) so it's not appropriate to characterise other topics as mere diversions.



Related to the above, the problem is Ryan, Palin, et al. make it so easy by manifesting their gross ignorance about the world and basic economic concepts or even arithmetic (such as if you want spend more government money than you have, you have to raise some more). If he had more time, Ryan would only further have shown his lack of knowledge and coherent thinking on any topic outside abortion. However, that appears not to matter, having seen the above. And as someone who lives in a country Ryan can't likely locate on a map without prior preparation, let alone have any idea of how it's economy or political system runs (and it's a major US ally) that's pretty scary.

With all due respect, Paul Ryan is one of the most economically savvy members of Congress, and as always, Australia's inferiority complex is manifested by a big chip on its shoulder. Never have they forgiven us for being "overpaid, oversexed and over here".

Agreed with that, Brother StuartK. There's a reason why Romney chose him.

Also, I think this website has it loud and clear as well.
http://www.catholicvote.org/discuss/index.php?p=36059

Look through the whole list for yourself.