www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Putin Gives Jaw-Dropping Defense of Christian Values

I guess it depends on which kind of society you wish to live in. Russian society, taking a stand on morality but not doing a great deal in the area of social service to those in need, or American society, which encourages immorality and degeneracy, but is long on giving and helping those in need.

Of course, a thought came to me after I typed the last paragraph. What motives might lurk behind the desire to be all over the world and be seen as a "generous benefactor?"

Remember, governments do nothing out of pure charity.

Most private charitable organizations are Christian organizations.

When I read or hear people's comments here and there saying that the world would be better without Christianity and the Catholic church, I would like to remind them about Catholic charities, which are not only HUGE in the U.S. but also in Europe. (Caritas, for instance)...

Anyway, I digress--indeed each country offers something, but again, the good that comes is always from the Church and Christ.

Getting back to Putin, we may have the Christian based charities which Russia does not have to help the world, but if the 'haters' (which are many, and growing, and many of them are fueled by the 'gay agenda' of the day and the media) get their way, that might come to an end one day in this country...
I foresee, and I pray I am wrong, the day that there will be a choice for churches--either accept and perform gay marriages or prepare to pay taxes.

In that light, Putin's Russia becomes more attractive.

Nothing like cementing good relations with acts thereof.

Confusion...

Are you talking about government aid,


or private charitable organizations?


...or both?

Let's not mix up the two.

P.S. Utroque: I think you made a mistake...Vladimir Putin does not hold the title of Prince, though he would make an awesome Tsar if he were of the right lineage. Oh well!

Maybe Counter-Intelligence and Propaganda Czar.. lol

Well, at least he's agreeable.. at the moment!

You don't need to pay attention to his excoriations of the West and its unchristian values. It is right before your eyes every day.

On a side note...I just read that Moscow is aligning with Egypt because relations with the U.S. soured and collapsed after Obama aligned himself with the Muslim Brotherhood terrorists.

Who exactly in Egypt is Putin aligning with?

The coast of my state is about as far east as one can get in the United States. We can't see Russia, but our little Samantha touched the heart of the "evil empire" some years ago. Most people here are hard-working and decent. On one side of our house are a lesbian couple; on the other, are pagans who have no use for organized religion. They tend their gardens and keep good homes. My wife and I abhor their values, but are happy they have the freedom to live by their lights, and we honor them as God's children. Such was not always the case here. At one time there was a bounty in Maine for Jesuits, and we would have been encouraged to throw dung at the doors of our neighbors. Christians have a tougher course now, but I pray we have the hope and courage to prevail. People are looking for a compassionate and forgiving Christianity. If it comes from Russia, or anyplace else, for that matter, God be praised.

Amen. If Russia can have even a small impact on issues such as abortion, I would shed tears of joy. We have a president who champions abortion....and the abortion mill (Planned Parenthood). It breaks my heart. It is genocide. The blood of more than 54 million voiceless martyrs cries out for justice.

I am thankful that Mr. Putin speaks out against such things. Whether or not it comes from his heart...I do not know. God knows.

I don't read hearts.

Dear Utroque,

Yes, you make very good points.

I think that those on this thread who speak highly of Putin appear to be idealizing an "Orthodox Russia" that really doesn't exist.

Ukrainian Orthodox and Catholics from Ukraine tend to be so in name only in my experience over the years. They go to church while being unchurched (thanks to so many years under the Soviets).

There are all manner of cults and sects in Ukraine and Russia, including pagan and satanic groups who go about murdering Orthodox priests and desecrating churches. There are even Hare Krishna members among the youth etc.

What I sense from the posts by Alice and others is a disappointment in the spiritual and moral contemporary climate of North America. That is a real concern, to be sure. And it is therefore quite natural to want to turn to a perceived spiritual "shangri-la" where there is the kind of perceived leader that "we should have here, but don't" and a society built on religious principles.

As for Mr. Putin, there can be no question but that we cannot know his spiritual state - no one can know that about anyone, except God.

But we can more than certainly comment on the political enterprise, now and in history, and how that enterprise has forever manipulated religious, patriotic and other human convictions toward its own ends.

I've worked with politicians for more than a quarter of a century and I can assure that the political caricature comes very close to the reality.

The article quoted above on Pravda's website - sorry, but there is just too much of the propaganda machine in Pravda period. Any media that calls itself "The Truth" can only be highly suspect as to the veracity of anything it publishes. (It's like someone telling us, "Hey, trust me!" ).

Slavipodvizhnyk is a Russian Orthodox patriot - more power to him. But no one should be uncritical about any enterprise. We all have taboos and there is certainly nothing wrong with that.

We should just remember that we understand reality through the prism of our own understanding that is always culturally conditioned. This means that our understanding and the conclusions we come to are not "Truth" as Pravda would always have us believe about its conclusions and perspectives. They are probabilistic at best.

Political leaders will always present themselves as patriotic and having their people's best interests at heart. They can also present themselves as religious within specific contexts where they can score points with others.

They can be deeply religious themselves or not when they do that. It is just in the nature of the political beast to want to manipulate impressions and messages to get a political bang for its buck.

And the "gay agenda" exists within the Church and even within seminaries, if the comments of some bishops are to be believed.

A political leader anywhere can be a knight in shining armour. But we should never be blinded by that armour's rays, knowing that every armour has its kinks.

Alex

Dear Recluse,

Abortion is rampant in Russia and Ukraine today. Please don't be shocked but I have a relative over there who has had SEVEN abortions. She is Orthodox and has never gone to confession to repent of those abortions. She says "everyone does it" as a form of birth control. She says those "things are not the church's business."

I just add this to argue against idealizing anyone or anything.

Alex

Dear Alex,

With all due respect, I don't think that anyone is idealizing life in Russia or any other Orthodox country.

What so many of us are admiring is the guts of Eastern European leaders (religious and political) to go against the gay agenda, and the promiscuous sexual agenda which the United States has imposed and encouraged beyond its own borders. Greece is also fighting the EU on this.

Having two mommies and two daddies through artificial means is not natural and normal and should not be promoted as natural and normal. Ask any child who has grown up without a mother or father figure if it felt wonderful. Ask any child who has not known its biological parent if they have not been curious to meet them or see them.

How does the two mommy child meet an anonymous 'sample', if you get the picture?

These crazy new ideas are travesties of God's world.

Again, I have no doubt as the honest, though misguided, intent of these couples to nurture a child.

I do foresee a day when tax exempt status will be taken away from churches if they do not perform gay marriages and tell the children of these families that their parents are normal and not sinning. I also predict that this whole gay thing is going to be the cause of persecution of Christians. The world has gone mad with homosexual pride imposing itself upon it.

Perhaps some Christians don't care about that, but they should.

Just my thoughts,
Alice

Fair enough, Mother Alice!

I'm going back to translating Akathists!

Cheers, Alex

Alex,

I know this.

But the Prime minister in Russia speaks out against it. And the president of the U.S. champions it. Big difference.

I agree, Alice. And I think it unfortunate that some people on this thread are attributing motives to Mr. Putin which run counter to the truth that he speaks about Christian morality.

I also agree with this also. The homosexual "pride" and the homosexual agenda which is being pushed down the throats of Christians.....is demonic. The day is coming (sooner rather than later) where we will face severe persecutions....and perhaps martyrdom....when we stand against these issues.