www.byzcath.org Forums General Discussions Town Hall Help keep Agia Sophia from becoming a mosque!

Force is not a option here. The Russians and Turks are too smart for this. They may cede to a Olive branch and millions EU', thouth.

BTW, Justinian I and Justin II built Hagia Sophia as a Christian Church not a Orthodox basilica. The throne ruled the Orthodoxy in those days not the other way arount. Soooo any christian can make a claim. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hagia_Sophia .....ustinian was a prolific builder; the historian Procopius bears witness to his activities in this area.[89] Under Justinian's patronage the San Vitale in Ravenna, which features two famous mosaics representing Justinian and Theodora, was completed.[20] Most notably, he had the Hagia Sophia, originally a basilica-style church that had been burnt down during the Nika riots, splendidly rebuilt according to a completely different ground plan, under the architectural supervision of Isidore of Miletus and Anthemius of Tralles. According to Procopius, Justinian stated at the completion of this edifice, "Solomon I have outdone thee" (in reference to the 1st Jewish temple). This new cathedral, with its magnificent dome filled with mosaics, remained the centre of eastern Christianity for centuries.

zarastra,

I know you didn't mean it to be offensive, but I find your proposal of an ecumenical Hagia Sophia offensive. As a Greek Catholic, the Hagia Sophia belongs to one person the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople. No one else belongs in that Church.

Hello: Slavipodvizhnik; your false statmentet .... "As far as sharing the Church with saracens and other Christian denominations, well, it's a non start with the Orthodox Church. The Altar of the first Church in Christendom cannot be defiled by those outside the faith." must have some background, otherwise it is just trollistic and banned by the Forum. All serious believers in Jesus Christ are in the flock of the Good Shepherd.

zarastra

You carry a dream since 1453. The Turks run it now. ..... We Christians must come forward with a sound fair proposal including financials or it is to be converted into a Mosque, ..... and the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople will be stuck in Russia until the Messianic era.

Matthew 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. One cannot be outside of the Church and be in it. And as far as a newbie telling me what is banned by the forum and calling me a troll, well......

John 3:16 NIV 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son. 19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but people loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil. 20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that their deeds will be exposed. 21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what they have done has been done in the sight of God.

All true believers are his Church and Flock of the Good Shepherd. Any denomination will due as long as you sincerely believe that God and Jesus are what the said they were.

Hello Ray S. :

What is a Greek Catholic ???? Are you under the Pope in the Vatican or the Orthodoxy in Russia. Are you Christian or just a member in a Greek denomination monastic that excludes all others.???

zarastra

Wow, you really have no idea about the Christian East, do you?

Very Very little. They might as well still be worshiping Zeus for all I know. I am a devout Christian and have much expertise in Constantine The Great, The Byzantine Empire and the Constitution. I am unaware when / how Christianity became "The Church " under some Eastern Guru. ...... The Hagia Sophia was built for Christianity, mugged by the Crusades, then Conquered by the Turks. It is time that real Christianity get a shot at the Byzantine sites from Istanbul to Jerusalem.

Define "real Christianity".

hello Slav:

You first: Whom are the "Church" and will be allowed unto Heaven???

BTW, where do you live ? If you can answer honestly without breaking a commandment. I cannot read Profiles as of yet.

z

Your video jamms and rattles my virus killers. Do you have safe sources?

Close to two thousand years ago, Jesus Christ, the Son of God, came to earth and founded the Church through His Apostles and disciples for the salvation of men. The teachings of the Apostles and the Church spread far in the years which followed; many Churches were founded, but all were united in faith, worship and the partaking of the sacraments.

To the group of Churches founded by the Apostles themselves belong the five Patriarchates of Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, Jerusalem and Rome. The Church of Constantinople was founded by St. Andrew, the Church of Alexandria by St. Mark, the Church of Antioch by St. Paul, the Church of Jerusalem by St. Peter and St. James, and the Church of Rome by St. Peter and St. Paul. Those founded in later years through missionary activity of the first Churches were the Churches of Sinai, Russia, Greece, Yugoslavia, Roumania and many more.

All of these churches are independent in their administration, yet they are in full communion with one another with the exception of the Church of Rome which separated in the year 1054. In faith, doctrine, Apostolic tradition, sacraments, liturgies and services they are exactly alike. Regardless of the language of each, they exist in fellowship and together constitute and call themselves the Orthodox Church.

The teachings of the Church are derived from two sources: Holy Scripture and Sacred Tradition, which complement each other. As written in the Gospel of St. John, "and there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world could not contain the books that should be written." These unwritten teachings were transmitted orally by the Apostles and come down to us in Sacred Tradition.

The faith and doctrines of the Church can be found in the Scriptures, the writings of the Church Fathers and in the canons and decrees of the Seven Ecumenical Councils. We believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is truly God, the Saviour, and the Son begotten of the same substance of the Father before all ages. He is also true man, like us in all respects except sin. We believe that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father, this being confirmed by the Second Ecumenical Council in the words used in the Symbol of Faith, "And I believe in the Holy Spirit, the Lord, the Giver of life, Who proceeds from the Father..."

The Orthodox worship God in Trinity, and honor and venerate the Saints and ask their intercession before God. Of the Saints, the Mother of God holds a special place because of the supreme grace and call she received from God. According to the canons of the Seventh Ecumenical Council, we venerate the sacred icons and relics not in themselves, but as representations of God and the Saints.

We recognize seven Sacraments: Baptism, Chrismation, Holy Eucharist, Confession, Ordination, Marriage and Holy Unction. Baptism and Chrismation (Confirmation) are the means of entrance for the Christian into the Church. For without dying to the old man and putting on the new in Baptism, we cannot receive the inheritance of the Kingdom which Christ restored to us. With Chrismation, we receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit. As the Spirit of God in the form of a Dove alighted on Christ, we receive Him in the Holy Chrism, becoming partakers in the fulness of Christ. In the Sacrament of the Holy Eucharist, we partake of the true Body and Blood of Christ, in the form of bread and wine, for the remission of sins and for life eternal. As it is written, Except ye eat of the flesh of the Son of Man and drink of His blood ye have no life in you. In confession we receive forgiveness of the sins we commit after Baptism if we truly repent of them. The foregoing three sacraments are essential for the life of all Christians.

By the laying-on of hands of a canonical Bishop, divine grace descends on him who is being ordained. This basic sacrament has provided uninterrupted succession to Orthodox clergy from the Holy Apostles and the establishment of the Church on the day of Pentecost. Divine grace sanctifies the union of two people in Matrimony as Christ blessed the wedding at Cana by His presence and the performance of His first miracle. Infirmities of the body and soul are healed through the sacrament of Holy Unction.

These, briefly, are some characteristics of the Orthodox Church. The Church is one because our Lord Jesus Christ founded only one Church. It is holy through the sanctification of its Founder and Head, Jesus Christ and the operation of the Holy Spirit. It is catholic because it is universal, and knows no limitations of place or time. It is apostolic because it was founded by the Holy Apostles. This is the Orthodox Church-the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church.


I live in Pennsylvania. No commandments broken. Now it's your turn.

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