www.byzcath.org Forums News & Events Church News Cardinal O'Malley

http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/01/cardinal-omalleys-methodist.html

Would Eastern Catholic bishops or Eastern Orthodox bishops do this. And according to Archbishop Muller, the SSPX are defacto Schismatics. Is Cardinal O'Malley playing house here?!.
Face it Latin rite bishops want to be "protestant". Need anymore proof!.

Lord have mercy!

The sound you hear is me screaming and tearing my hair out!!

Why is anyone surprised by this?

I'm not surprised. I wrote him off when I saw his televised celebrity appearance at the Ted Kennedy funeral. That's all it was, a celebrity appearance.

The Latin church needs to do some serious soul searching on what it is. They need to deiced if they are the bearers of God's word or just an International Social Work agency that meets on Sunday mornings and other selected days.

What's worse, he is a monk. Monks should be humble and not seeking to change what has been given to them and obedience.
I am not criticising him as a bishop, but he should be setting an example for the faithful.

Christ is in our midst!!

I'm not surprised. Look at the landscape since the election of the new Pope. Conservative bishops and cardinals have been sidelined. The new marching orders are to be "pastoral," which has seemed to be code since the 1960s for overlooking many things that were formerly dealt with in a more strict fashion. Look at the turnaround here.

There were predictions in the Latin Church in the 1960s that the day would come when bishops and cardinals would be at odds over the Faith. That day has been creeping up on us and had been held in check by the past two Popes. We have to wait and see where this will end. ISTM that we now have the relativism that Pope Benedict warned against on the eve of the conclave that elected him.

Is it any wonder that the Lord mused about whether He would find faith on the earth at His return?

To the original question as to whether Orthodox and Eastern Catholic bishop would do this-- IMHO, Orthodox bishops would not since there is a synodal principle that would pull the erring one in and end his service. Eastern Catholic bishops--the judgment is still to come in. Catholic bishops have no synod to call them to accountability. Each has a separate relationship with the Pope and no one can call them on the carpet but the Pope and his dicasteries. So we have wild swings in what is tolerated from diocese to diocese. And we have turnarounds when a new bishop is sent in depending on the charge the new man is given.

Bob

Bob, I think you are right! I find it helpful that I work for the Latins, but look to the Byzantines for my faith - not that our leaders are always better. We do have a more firm grasp on tradition and that helps.

What slays me is the fact that our Catechism does not even recognize the orders of the ecclesial community in which this event took place. But I guess if you're highly enough placed the rules don't apply to you. Does the word "scandal" have the grave connotation it once did?

Bob

I will use a football analogy as the Super Bowl is near.

We in the east do not lack for sufficient referees. We have no league office to resolve onfield disputes when the refs disagree.

The Church of Rome has a strong commissioner, but no referees.

I find these types of things depressing, but there really is nothing that a layman can do about it.

For a long, long time Catholics of the Latin rite have dipped their finger tips in a bowl of Holy Water, blessing themselves as they enter the church, as a reminder of their Baptism. Popes, bishops, priests, nuns, monks and laymen have done this. It takes no special "orders" to do this. It has long been a custom, also, to extend ones hand, once having done so, to other individuals who could not reach the bowl conveniently.

What is the fuss over what Boston's good archbishop has done? Such ecumenical services have been commonplace for more than 45 years now. The Catholic Church has long recognized the validity of non-Catholic baptisms done in the name of the Holy Trinity and with the right intention. The common acceptance of this sacrament is a small thread of unity that helps bind us to others of whom there is little else in common. Cardinal Sean was not being baptized or anointed. He was accepting this reminder of his Baptism, and he is their archbishop whether this Methodist congregation recognizes this or not. For him to be in their midst accepting a gesture of commonality is, for me at least, praiseworthy and hardly merits the harsh condemnation raining down from above.

Defense: no sacrament was involved. The cardinal was being gracious to a born Protestant, ecumenical. Good point that we recognize Methodist baptism. So, strictly speaking, not heretical?

The obvious problem: scandal because he (intentionally?) LOOKED like he was recognizing a Protestant minister's ordination and like he was agreeing with them that the church can change the matter of the sacraments by vote (women's ordination - Methodists don't claim "orders" or believe ordination is a sacrament but you know what I mean).

Another old liberal Catholic being sort of a mainline Protestant wannabe. But a cardinal archbishop?

The new springtime under Pope Benedict has been postponed. Just wait for the old liberals to die.

Yup.

But for centuries in the East and West, the church largely ran based on immemorial custom. The Pope was a much more remote figure in Catholicism than many think. The church largely ran itself. And something like this incident would have been unthinkable.

As far as I know, an Eastern bishop including the Orthodox wouldn't do anything this dumb.