www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West What the West Thinks of Tradition

More sad news for a Religious Order established by Pope John Paul II and nurtured by Pope Benedict XVI. An attack on tradition in Italy. The papal document Summourum Pontificum, which allowed priests to say the Mass of 1962 (aka TLM) without a Bishops approval. Banned by a Caputhan priest who has a lust for power on orders from another Pope, Pope Francis. Who you all admire. Warning to all Byzantine Catholics. Your rite is not protected either. Since Rome and this current Pontificate cares less about what other Pontificates have said or done. They could ban the Divine Liturgies as well as supress the Byzantine rite in the future. Don't think than can't!. What they have done to the Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate, just proves what they can do!. Just a warning to watch out!!. Rome right now will sacrifice their traditiona to appeas modern day society. Don't think the Byzantine tradition is untouchable by this Pontificate. This watchdog Fr. Volpi may knock on your door and shut you down, and throw your Metropolitan Archeparch Skurla into exile, under orders from Francis. Don't think it can't happen! It can!!

http://rorate-caeli.blogspot.com/2014/01/the-franciscans-of-immaculate-under.html
http://pray4thefriars.wordpress.com/2014/01/14/just-3/

I saw this news some time ago. A good friend of mine is a Traditionalist Latin Catholic (not schismatic). He is very upset. There seems to be a rapidly growing uneasiness amongst the more traditionally minded Catholics because of this Pope.

Absolute nonsense!

Exactly. The Pope is a friend to the UGCC and knows the liturgy intimately. I don't think that would happen.

Here's an excerpt from another news article about the matter:

According to Fr. Bruno, in a survey carried out during the apostolic visit, the vast majority of the order’s members had said they did not agree that the Old Latin Rite should be the exclusive form used for mass celebrations, “particularly in the pastoral care programmes of Italian parishes and in the missions.”

In some cases, the Old Rite did not go down particularly well. The spokesman for the Congregation of Franciscan Friars of the Immaculate said that “if people don’t understand, the message doesn’t get through.”

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/en/the-vatican/detail/articolo/vaticano-vatican-vaticano-26865/

Some things to note here:
(1) This is involving a matter in the Latin Church. I don't believe there is any justification to "cry wolf" here among Easterns and Orientals.
(2) The decree was issued by a Commission, not the Pope.
(3) The decree was issued only after assessing the viewpoints of the members of the order, which indicated that the greater part preferred the Liturgy in the vernacular in order to witness more effectively.
(4) Commissions are basically semi-automous. They make decrees, but they can be revised by the Pope if he is made aware of the issues.
(5) This was not some sort of unilateral action by the Pope, as fearmongers like to pretend about the papacy.

Blessings,
Marduk

In my opinion, I don't think the Liturgy of the Eastern Catholic Church will be affected. But the situation is disturbing nonetheless.

You know, between Facebook, the various forums, and other sites on the Internet, it seems like there is always someone who is telling me that the world is coming to an end and we are all going to be taken out and shot.

Then....the week after I see such a report, I see another one that totally debunks the first one. It's gotten to the point that in order to keep my A.) sanity B.) blood pressure down C.) from making stupid knee-jerk statements, I refuse to get crazed about such posts.

My response has become "Hmmmmmmmmmmm....interesting. We'll see."

Meanwhile, I have all I can handle with my own struggle to become more Christ-like.

The purpose of our life is to be alive in Christ. And with God becoming man, it is now possible. Remember this. Live a different way from the rest of the world. And if there are things in you that are living like the world, beg God to help you with them. Do something about it. You were born for perfection. Don’t wallow in mediocrity. None of us should be mediocre. All of us should know God, and feel God in everything we do; with every breath we take, we should feel the Holy Spirit. If we do not feel this, then we must change the way we live. This is the purpose of life—to live a different way from just being a human—to live as a Christ-human. The Greeks have a word, Theanthropos, or God-man. We are also to become God-men. We call Jesus Christ the God-man, but we are to become God-men. We are to become like God and to be united with God, and to do godly things, to have the knowledge of God, to be united to Him in holiness, wisdom, and purpose.

Excerpt from a homily by Fr Seraphim

And now for the real story:
http://www.catholicworldreport.com/Item/2788/Hype_and_Hope_for_the_FFI.aspx

The real story? Are you sure? The comments on this version do not seem to agree with you. Could there be a disgruntled modernist faction within the order? I don't know.

Yes. It is a disgruntled traditionlist faction, both in and outside of the Church, trying to exploit the situation in the FFI order for their own purposes.

I am reading many accounts that state the opposite of the story that you posted. I suppose the real story will come out eventually. I tend to believe that the problem proceeds from a disgruntled modernist faction.

Anything can happen, I suppose.

The New Rite / Old Rite tussles in the Latin Church have certain cultural, political, and even generational components, particularly in Europe and South America. In some places, true or not, Latin Trads are viewed as being throne-and-altar royalists (not that there's anything wrong with that) or holding other "dangerous" (read="unfashionable") opinions. Further, whole ecclesiastical careers and egos have been built around the New Rite and its implementation. There's more to it than these examples, but they are off the top of my head.

Put another way, the two Roman Rites are sometimes the battlefields for wars-by-proxy over other issues that have absolutely nothing to do with liturgy.

The Greek Rite simply doesn't have this dynamic, at least not at this time, praise be to God.

Speaking as an upstate New York nobody, from what I can tell, Pope Francis does not appear particularly sympathetic to that tradition which I can only think to call the "Tridentine / Neo-Scholastic synthesis." This seems in keeping with his generation and culture.

But Papa doesn't seem hostile to other traditions. In fact he appears downright friendly to the Greek Rite, and he also liberalized the rules for who may officially join the Anglican Ordinariate. It's an interesting pontificate, to be sure.

I do admire your zeal for the Greek Rite, though.

And bear in mind that the Eastern Catholic liturgies are protected by the decree of Vatican II. That certainly does not apply to the Tridentine Latin rite.

It certainly does apply, but anyway when did what Vatican 2 actually said amount to anything?