www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life The Christian East & West Eastern terminology question

Ok. So it sounds like the two titles are used interchangeably maybe...Thank you.

In less formal use, also sometimes just "Father [name]". At least in Russian usage.

Incidentally, the title "Father" for secular priests comes from Irish custom, which the English adopted after the restoration of the Catholic hierarchy. Other languages have fancy titles for secular priests deriving from their titles for prince or lord (ksiadz, kniaz, don come to mind -- Polish, Slovak, Italian).
(CofE ministers were Mr. or Rev'd Mr. -- I can remember when deacons were formally Rev. Mr.)
Re. whether Latin or Orthodox customs prevail among Eastern Catholics as to indelible marks and such, one thing I remember from Byz. Cat. seminary over 20 yrs ago was when one of us was ordained sudeacon, someone mentioned that if he were to leave the clerical life (he did not, unfortunately he passed away being a priest for about 20 yrs.) he would have to be laicised, so perhaps ECs follow Latin custom. I have not had much witness of EC practice lately, but I suppose they are still finding their way, yet still beholden to the Latin was of doing things since ther are deeply imbedded in Latin infrastructure.

I believe that Fr. Francis Vivona here in town is the ordinary for the Greco-Albano-Italo Catholics in the U.S. His parish, though, is attached to the Metropolia Formerly Known as Ruthenian, while the other parish in the US (in NY) is attached to the Latin Diocese, and there are two and a half[1] (?) missions in the US.

hawk

[1] AFAIK, the joint Eastern/Latin mission up the hill, the only known one, is currently defunct.

Doc,
Why do you say that the Pittsburgh Metropolia is formerly Ruthenian ? What is it now if not Ruthenian ?
Thanks for your explanation.

Ruthenians in America no longer use the Ruthenian Liturgy. Check out the book written by Father David Petras. He argues that the inherited Ruthenian liturgy is inadequate to serve the needs of present day Ruthenians. So they banned it and did a re-write to create something different. So instead of it being called the "Ruthenian Recension" it's now called the "Petras Resension". At least by the priests in Ohio.

Interesting take. I'll say, "that is all."

Aye yia yia

Hawk,

While Father Archimandrite Francis is often referred to as such, the reference is informal - there is no designated 'ordinary' for the Italo-Greico-Albanians in the US.

Father is presently one of only three priests in the US who are 'formally' (loose usage) ascribed to the Church. Father Archimandrite Januarius (Izzo) has been confined to a nursing home for the past several years. The third priest, whose name I apologize, I've forgotten, was ordained by Bishop Gerald to the service of the Italo-Grieco-Albanians somewhat recently.

There is, sadly, no parish in NY. Our Lady of Grace Society, headquartered there, is the surviving historical descendent of the original and only US parish of the Church. (The former editor of the Society's newsletter is a member here.) Our Lady of Wisdom in LV is a parish of the Metropolia, established to serve the Italo-Greico-Albanian community there, but, canonically, is a Ruthenian parish.

There are no missions, other than the one in LV which you indicate has closed. Other than Our Lady of Grace, which was a parish and a mission at various times in its history, there has never been another US mission.

Many years,

Neil

Not "formerly Ruthenian", but "formerly known as Ruthenian."

We had a couple of name changes for the diocese/eparchy. The current name no longer includes "Ruthenian."

hawk

I believe he was the deacon at OLOW.


My understanding is that it has the same standing in our dioces as eastern parishes attached to latin bishops. They mostly work off of our liturgical books (the last time I was there, they were still using the Red ones).

Yes. That's precisely what I meant by


Many years,

Neil