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Dec 29th, 2019
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Joined: Dec 2001
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Posted on the Rorate Caeli blog: Today I am publishing the 21st in our series of Position Papers. This one looks at the Eastern Churches: or rather, the attitude of the Holy See to the Eastern Churches and their liturgical traditions. This attitude has long been one of the utmost respect. This respect, however, is in clear tension with the attacks on the traditions of the West which, while not coming from the Magisterium, have become a dominating feature of liturgical discussion since the Second Vatican Council. In this context, the Position Paper argues that respect for the Vetus Ordo, a respect which is manifested in practice at every level of the Church, is necessary if Eastern Christians of all kinds are to be expected to take seriously the protestations of respect for their traditions which are made so often at the highest levels of the Church. Source. [ rorate-caeli.blogspot.com] [ lms.org.uk] Additional commentary. [ lmschairman.org]
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Post deleted.
Last edited by griego catolico; 11/18/14 05:32 PM. Reason: Other thread on same topic has been merged with this thread, making my post from that thread redundant here.
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I was going to post this. The problems over the years regarding Latinization are not a function of modern popes, but rather westernized clergy, bishops and westernized religious orders.For whatever reason, in the Eparchy of Mucachevo in Transcarpathia for example the Greek Cathoics follow the same rubrics as do we in the ACROD (obviously we each do not commemorate exactly the same saints) while in Slovakias Eparchy of Presov there appears to.be a greater western influence. In America, Parma bas been the most Eastern in practice. Churches served by ECC clergy educated in Rome at the Russicom often are indistinguishable from their Orthodox counterparts...sometimes they are more "vostochnyj".But..the people often prefer the less "authentic" and shorter form of services!
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Indeed. An old chum who is now a Bulgarian OCA priest knew of a priest who transferred to the OCA from the Orthodox Church in Slovakia. His liturgical praxis was Greek Catholic to a tee.
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Indeed. An old chum who is now a Bulgarian OCA priest knew of a priest who transferred to the OCA from the Orthodox Church in Slovakia. His liturgical praxis was Greek Catholic to a tee. I would counterargue that his rubrics were obviously neither Bulgarian nor Russian having been less influenced by the reforms in Russian practice of the 17th century. Same old arguments used by the Rusifiers throughout the 20th century in America and one reason why so many angry Greek Catholics were afraid to follow others into Orthodoxy. But swimming the Bosphorus rather than say crossing the Dneiper turned out to be an option acceptable to many.
Last edited by DMD; 11/19/14 07:25 AM.
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Sorry. It was late and I tend to be less specific. The priest from Slovakia was serving in an ethnically nonspecific (i.e. Russian typikon) OCA parish and appeared to have same quasi-latinised praxis as older Greek Catholic priests whom we knew were accustomed to rather than the Russian way one would expect in an OCA parish or from a priest from a Church which returned to Orthodoxy. It obviously was not to big a deal to his hierarchs if he continued this way, so it should not be to me either.
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Of course there is Russian praxis and then there is RUSSIAN PRAXIS. LOL
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Is Joseph Shaw aware that Ruthenian Greek Catholics are prohibited from celebrating the normative and official version of the Ruthenian Divine Liturgy from the books published by Rome and are only permitted to celebrate the "Revised Divine Liturgy" (aka "2007 Ruthenian Low Mass")?
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Who imposed this stricture on the Ruthenian Greek Catholics? And for what benefit? And to whom?
Thanks.
Ivanov
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As far as Ruthenian Greek Catholics in America are concerned, this imposition was effected by their hierarchy, with all due respect to our hosts.
I cannot remember everything I learned 24 yrs ago, but I was told that when the Ruthenian Recension was issued in, what, the '50s, Frs. Pekar and Hornyak wanted to implement it at the G.C. seminary in Pittsburgh where they were on staff. The bishop at the time said no, and basically told them to get you to a monastery. Greek Catholics in America have heard of Fr. Pekar through some of his writings, I suppose. Fr. Hornyak eventually became Ukrainian G. C. bishop of London, where he was egregiously mistreated by Ukrainian militant nationalists.
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