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Dec 29th, 2019
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Cardinal who openly promoted divorce was publicly rebuked by Greek-Melkite PatriarchTronto Catholic Witness Wednesday, 7 October 2015 http://torontocatholicwitness.blogspot.ca/2015/10/holy-see-press-office-cover-up-cardinal.html [ Linked Image] Cardinal Maestrojuan Here is one happening that was NOT mentioned in the Synod Briefings ... It took place on Monday, October the 5th, 2015 and is reported by an eminent European Prelate, Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki on his blog: http://abpgadecki.pl/popoludniowa-sesja-2-dzien-synodu/ Cardinal Jose Luiz Lacunza Maestrojuan, the president of the Panamanian Bishops' Conference, and Rapporteur at the Synod of the Family suggested on October 5, 2015, during his alloted three minute speech, that the Law of Christ be overturned and the Church adapt a position on divorce following Moses. The Cardinal was quoted by Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki (translated by Toronto Catholic Witness) as saying: "Moses drew near to the people and gave way. Likewise today, the 'hardness of hearts' opposes God's plan. Could Peter not be merciful like Moses"? There we have it: a priest of Jesus Christ, a bishop, a Prince of the Church openly before his brother bishops, before the whole Church: contradicting Our Lord Jesus Christ! [ Linked Image] Patriarch Laham However! A voice of Catholic sanity, from the Greek-Melkite Patriarch of Antioch, His Beatitude Gregory III Laham, responded: "One should always speak of the "sacrament of matrimony" and not "marriage". To show the spiritual beauty of marriage. To assist spouses one must show them the unchangeable, spiritual vision of matrimony. Many times we are not united with the positive vision of marriage and the family. Jesus corrected Moses. Dissoluble marriage is against its nature".
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Well, so much for de-Latinization.
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The Melkite Patriarch is correct. It has nothing to do with Latinization whatsoever. Count how many times "indissoluble" is used here: http://orthodoxwiki.org/Marriage
Last edited by Michael_Thoma; 10/08/15 06:02 AM.
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Right, let's just ignore the practice of the Eastern churches from before the schism.
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You mean dissolubility is to be promoted? Is that what happens in Orthodox Churches? My understanding is that in the East this is treated as a concession, economia - although still not allowable. What is being promoted by certain Latin factions is allowable divorce with no penalty mentioned.
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Right, let's just ignore the practice of the Eastern churches from before the schism. I would think (and do) that the Melkite Patriarch is a reliable interpreter and voice of "the practice of the Eastern churches from before the schism."
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Certainly, the Orthodox Church allows for second sacramental marriages after dissolving the first one for canonical reasons.
Unlike the Latin Catholic Church, the Orthodox do not pretend that the first marriage, even after many years and several children being produced, "never" took place and is therefore to be annulled . . .
I don't understand the position of the Melkite prelate since it is neither in keeping with the age-old practice of Orthodoxy nor is it in keeping with the growing trend for "annulments" in the Latin West (which is just another face-saving name for 'divorce').
The Latin prelate's position is a more realistic one and one that is actually closer to that of Orthodoxy.
Alex
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Actually, prior to the Schism of 1054, divorce and sacramental remarriage was allowed by the Churches of the East. The Emperor St Constantine VI was married four times this way . . .
Alex
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And what happens among Catholics is . . . semantics . . .
Alex
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Divorce among the Orthodox is not taken lightly as compared to modern American Protestants or the kind of American mush we have now. I have seen Orthodox confession aids which state that you have to confess if you contemplate getting a divorce. I think the dynamic is different with the Orthodox vis-a-vis everyone else, not only because of the antiquity of their doctrine and praxis but there is an added dimension of being ministered to in a non-anonymous way by their clergy.
I think it is interesting when people who would be otherwise suddenly become scriptural fundamentalists when there is a text that corroborates their position. Marriage in the Church is different from that referenced by our Lord in the law of Moses. It is now an analogy of Christ's relation to the Church, as St. Paul wrote in Ephesians. This would give one even greater reluctance to divorce...but let us not assume that divorce allowed in the Church in the First Millenium is exactly the same as divorce as we now know it. This topic deserves closer examination beyond which I am capable.
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Certainly, the Orthodox Church allows for second sacramental marriages after dissolving the first one for canonical reasons.
Unlike the Latin Catholic Church, the Orthodox do not pretend that the first marriage, even after many years and several children being produced, "never" took place and is therefore to be annulled . . .
I don't understand the position of the Melkite prelate since it is neither in keeping with the age-old practice of Orthodoxy nor is it in keeping with the growing trend for "annulments" in the Latin West (which is just another face-saving name for 'divorce').
The Latin prelate's position is a more realistic one and one that is actually closer to that of Orthodoxy.
Alex This interpretation of the Catholic position is misleading; it is a cynical appraisal and an insult to the underlying theology. One may have cause to disagree with that theological viewpoint but I believe it is most faithful to the Gospel and Tradition. Sustained incorrect practice is a poor justification for the theology of a Mystery.
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Actually, prior to the Schism of 1054, divorce and sacramental remarriage was allowed by the Churches of the East. The Emperor St Constantine VI was married four times this way . . .
Alex "St." ? ..."married four times"? Please, more details.
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I'd say consider the source regarding this article and what the Melkite Patriarch did or did not actually say and what the Cardinal did or did not say. AS well as the full context of the exchange.
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Excellent suggestion, DMD.
From the themes of the blog, it looks, as the French would say, integriste.
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Excellent suggestion, DMD.
From the themes of the blog, it looks, as the French would say, integriste. Perhaps we need a return to a balanced Catholic Integralism. The prevailing culture preaches a secular-pluralistic integrism of its own that marginalizes people of faith. Not all that is different and new is good. I'd say consider the source regarding this article and what the Melkite Patriarch did or did not actually say and what the Cardinal did or did not say. AS well as the full context of the exchange. So consider it and inform rather than giving oblique inferences: even ultra-conservatives can report the truth. Is Archbishop Gadecki a reliable source? Apart from interpretations and commentary, what did the Cardinal and Patriarch say and was it accurately reported, allowing that we do not have the full context of the exchange? This no-longer-working link, Strona nie została znaleziona Episkopat Polski [ abpgadecki.pl] appeared to have the minutes/notes of Archbishop Gadecki (in what I thought was Italian though the link address is in French). To the best I could determine, the words attributed to Cardinal and Patriarch in the Toronto Catholic Witness as given in the initial post are an accurate rendering in English of what was given in the previous link, http://abpgadecki.pl/interventions-...ux-deuxieme-assemblee-generale-10052015.The essence then: Is this reporting of Archbishop Gadecki to be considered reliable? Cardinal Jose Luiz Lacunza Maestrojuan: Moses drew near to the people and gave way. Likewise today, the 'hardness of hearts' opposes God's plan. Could Peter not be merciful like Moses? Greek-Melkite Patriarch of Antioch Gregory III Laham: One should always speak of the "sacrament of matrimony" and not "marriage". To show the spiritual beauty of marriage. To assist spouses one must show them the unchangeable, spiritual vision of matrimony. Many times we are not united with the positive vision of marriage and the family. Jesus corrected Moses. Dissoluble marriage is against its nature.
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