The Byzantine Forum
Newest Members
EasternChristian19, James OConnor, biblicalhope, Ishmael, bluecollardpink
6,161 Registered Users
Who's Online Now
1 members (EasternChristian19), 1,782 guests, and 91 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Latest Photos
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
St. Sharbel Maronite Mission El Paso
by orthodoxsinner2, September 30
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
Holy Saturday from Kirkland Lake
by Veronica.H, April 24
Byzantine Catholic Outreach of Iowa
Exterior of Holy Angels Byzantine Catholic Parish
Church of St Cyril of Turau & All Patron Saints of Belarus
Forum Statistics
Forums26
Topics35,508
Posts417,509
Members6,161
Most Online3,380
Dec 29th, 2019
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#424550 06/13/24 04:51 PM
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
B
Junior Member
Junior Member
B Offline
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
So, please enlighten me. I was reading Bishop Kallistos's Ware book, The Orthodox Church, on the issue of divorce/remarriage: ''Orthodox Canon Law, while permitting a second or even a third marriage, absolutely forbids a fourth. In theory the Canons only permit divorce in cases of adultery, but in practice, it is granted for other reasons as well (288).''
This is my question. We can all debate whether divorce should be allowed (and if it is when it is allowed). For many, the issue of remarriage is even more controversial than divorce but neither is my main question here.
Let's assume for the sake of argument that divorce/remarriage is allowed. If our Lord allows both, then why are they allowed only three times? Why not seven times? What is the Eastern Orthodox Biblical and historical defense for the occasional permission for a third remarriage but none afterward?


Bibliography
Ware, Timothy. The Orthodox Church. Third edition, 2015. Penguin Ranhome House UK.

Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337
Likes: 24
Moderator
Member
Moderator
Member
Joined: Aug 1998
Posts: 4,337
Likes: 24
You must understand that originally second marriage even in the case of death was only begrudgingly allowed. After that adultery, abandonment, abuse and apostasy were added. And the service for the second marriage was different from the first with many penitential prayers. Third marriage was allowed because the Emperor demanded it to so he could produce an heir and he actually ended up needing a fourth. After this the Church made three the limit and stuck with it. A third marriage is a rare exception.

https://www.ancientfaith.com/podcasts/hopko/re_marriage_in_the_orthodox_church


My cromulent posts embiggen this forum.
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
B
Junior Member
Junior Member
B Offline
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
Father, thank you for that reply (and further clarification on allowances for divorce). Please understand my intent. I'm primarily posting this as I am considering joining the Orthodox Church but find this to be a stumbling issue for me. How could the emperor change the legality of when divorce is allowed and force it on the church? Is not the Orthodox Church the one true church of Jesus Christ? Therefore, it shouldn't stay the same forever.
For many years, I rejected the Eastern Orthodox view of original sin. Now, my struggles with their teachings are more on birth control and divorce/remarriage, where I seem to agree with the Cathokic position more. At the same time, I agree with the Eastern Orthodox view of the papacy.

Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,522
Likes: 24
Member
Member
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 1,522
Likes: 24
Orthodoxy operates and adjudicates using the principle of exonomia, not prescedent.

Yes, the "three strikes. you're out" rule has been hard and fast for centuries.

And yes. the services for second and third marriages (regardless of whether necessitated by divorce or widowhood) and very subdued and penitential.

Nevertheless, eonomia can aboumd. as the case of a never-married goddaughter whose husband was once divorced. They were Crowned (with my Hierarch's blessing) using the rite of [first]Marriage.

Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
B
Junior Member
Junior Member
B Offline
Joined: Dec 2023
Posts: 13
Likes: 1
I am curious. What Church Fathers or passages of Scripture do they use to justify the ''three strikes, you're out''?. Catholics would appeal to Matthew 19 and Augustine's writings and say remarriage after divorce is forbidden (even though there are significant annulment abuses in the church today). This is a stumbling block for me. I don't see how the Orthodox Church is the one unchanged church if this is its position.

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,334
Likes: 96
Moderator
Member
Moderator
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,334
Likes: 96
Christ is in our midst!!

I want to make an observation that is tangential to this thread. Divorce is a terrible destruction to a relationship that was initially meant to have Christ be a partner. Two believers were joined to be "one flesh." They were meant to grow together as two plants in a single pot do--to become rooted together. In this way and with Christ at the center and around the edges, a domestic church is formed.

The destruction that divorce causes can damage the spiritual life of either or both members of this union that finds itself broken. It is even worse when children are involved.

The damage goes beyond the spiritual, emotional, and psychological to the material. Very often there are financial matters that cause damage to both parties.

I say all this because I am close to this matter in my own family--not me, but someone very close to me. I see the toll that it is taking on my close relative and the children involved.

I have also seen the damage that can occur when a divorced person with children attempts to forge a new family, often with someone else who also has children. Sometimes bouncing the children between other homes at different times causes more chaos than the initial divorce situation.

It is a sad commentary that we can even speak of divorce, remarriage, and these related issues.

Let's pray for those people who are struggling with their marriages--and we all do at times if we are honest with each other--broken marriages, irregular marriages, divorces, abusive marriages, etc. Let's work to support them in any way we can without inserting ourselves and making things worse.

Joined: Sep 2024
Posts: 77
Likes: 1
J
Member
Member
J Offline
Joined: Sep 2024
Posts: 77
Likes: 1
How can we best support and pray for those dealing with the pain of divorce and its impact on families, without causing further harm?

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,334
Likes: 96
Moderator
Member
Moderator
Member
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 7,334
Likes: 96
Christ is in our midst!!

John Steve,

Be open to listen, offer no advice unless asked (and then be very careful), and simply put this in the Lord's Hands.


Moderated by  theophan 

Link Copied to Clipboard
The Byzantine Forum provides message boards for discussions focusing on Eastern Christianity (though discussions of other topics are welcome). The views expressed herein are those of the participants and may or may not reflect the teachings of the Byzantine Catholic or any other Church. The Byzantine Forum and the www.byzcath.org site exist to help build up the Church but are unofficial, have no connection with any Church entity, and should not be looked to as a source for official information for any Church. All posts become property of byzcath.org. Contents copyright - 1996-2024 (Forum 1998-2024). All rights reserved.
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 8.0.0