www.byzcath.org Forums Faith & Christian Life Faith & Theology TOWARDS A COMMON DATE OF EASTER: REMAINING FAITHFUL TO NICAEA

I'm sorry I have been out of the loop for so long to have missed this fascinating thread!

Prayers for a common Easter date beginning, hopefully, after next year. Hopefully too - a common Nicene Creed in its original text (I won't use the "F" word).

Certainly, Constantinople or at least the Ecumenical patriarch (Many years!) believes the time has come to proclaim formal Communion between the Churches. Symbols are important as are symbolic gestures so if these take place next year - let's just keep our fingers crossed shall we?

Perhaps Rome could also formally proclaim Sts Gregory Palamas and Photios the Great as Doctors of the universal Church . . .that would be good too!

Why should the Catholic Church advocate more strongly for the Gregorian calendar and Paschalion, especially as discussions approach for a common date of Easter in 2025? Could adopting the Gregorian Paschalion honor the spirit of the Nicaean Council?

Christ is in our midst!!

John Steve,

Have you not read the complete thread on this point? The Gregorian calendar corrected the misalignment of the calendar with the actual changing of seasons. It is probably the best alignment with the intention of the Fathers of Nicaea.

Synodica V (Chambésy - Genève, Les Editions du Centre Orthodoxe, 1981) is the report of the Congress for the Examination of the Question of a Common Celebration of Easter by All Christians on the Same Sunday – Minutes and Texts; 152 pages.

Three Orthodox astronomers did calculations that were reported at that Congress, June 28-July 3, 1977. Only one of the thee attended and presented at that Congress, Prof. Georges Contopoulos. Here is an excerpt from his presentation, p 55:

I've been wanting to do an update of calendar news and Nicaea conferences.

In October 2024 I submitted an article A Common Easter: Is there an alternative to the Aleppo Proposal? [academia.edu] to Public Orthodoxy [publicorthodoxy.org] as a follow-up to the May 1, 2024 article Preparing the Orthodox for the Date of Pascha [publicorthodoxy.org] by Fr. Anthony Roeber. I eventually withdrew it and then was told (with a kind apology) that I had not been informed that they had 'found the discussion generally a bit too "advanced" for our typical readership...' (I took note that they did not tell me to modify it.) Public Orthodoxy is a ' “public-facing” initiative of the Orthodox Christian Studies Center [fordham.edu].

On March 20, 2025, Dr. George Demacopoulos of Fordham will speak on Nicea and the Challenge of a Common Day for Easter [publicorthodoxy.org] at Stockton University. Hopefully his talk will be recorded and made available.

There are two upcoming international conferences, both in Rome.

Nicaea and the Church of the Third Millennium [iota-web.org] 4-7 June 2025.
Nicaea 2025: Context, Event, and Reception [angelicum.it] April 2 - April 5, 2025.

I submitted an abstract for the April conference that was accepted.

Abstract I consider the development of the "Nicaean Norm" for Pascha from its biblical prototype, through its development and application in the Julian and Gregorian Paschalia, to the recent proposal in the WCC's Aleppo statement. This is an overview of the theology and technology that enters into the Church Calendar and the essential criteria for a common observance of Easter. A new approach is proposed that bridges the historical gap between the traditional method of computus and the detailed astronomical approach (as reported in Synodica V, Chambésy - Genève, Les Editions du Centre Orthodoxe, 1981.)

As of now I'll be speaking (one of the numerous 25 min. breakout talks) on April 3. I'll report here on how it goes.

ajk, good luck on April 3!

Is your paper A Common Easter: Is there an alternative to the Aleppo Proposal? still on academia.edu? I can only find the abstract.

Thanks Mockingbird.

It was hard enough as a 25 min. talk (I'm a detail person.) but it is now just 20 min. with 5 for questions. I'm still working on getting it down to size while not having it become disjointed, and it's still a speed read. I will post it "as given."

Back from Rome, mission accomplished!

The "calendar" was not a prominent topic although there was a plenary talk on the last day. The program is HERE [academia.edu]. My talk was the first in one of the breakout sessions that was the last time slot on the 2nd day; see page 15 of the program. It was an eclectic session, as noted by the last speaker. All the numbered Aulas were good-sized classrooms on the 4th floor, with windows to the outside, unlike the big Aula minor and Aula magna on the ground floor. My Aula 2 had a window with the best view of the bunch: the dome of St. Peter's.

The Patristicum or Augustinianum is a left turn just off the Colonnade (about half way around when facing St. Peter's).

I have posted my talk, The Nicaean Norm and the dating of Pascha: A new approach to an old problem [academia.edu] as given but added some footnotes and appendices to provide more context.

A further acknowledgement to the ones in the paper is for all who have contributed to the numerous discussions of the calendar on this forum.

Also, see the updated program for the next conference at the Angelicum, 4-7 June, Nicaea and the Church of the Third Millennium Conference [iota-web.org] that has significant talks on the calendar etc. by some of the heavy hitters: Nicaea 2025 Conference Program DRAFT [iota-web.org].

ajk, I enjoyed reading the writeup of your talk.

I continue to hold that the lunar months in your new computus should begin on the day _after_ the conjunction.

Thanks, Mockingbird, I value your opinion..

Is this done to approximate the sighting of the first visible crescent?

Yes. It's what Clavius did with the epacts for the Gregorian calendar, though he said he set the new moons to a day or two after "the mean new moon of the astronomers" in order to have the 14th day of the moon closer to the visible full moon.

I do something similar in my calculation.

Here's the reasoning. The graph in Appendix B shows the astronomical values as the scattered dots. The overall best single value that represents the detailed astronomical data is a constant, average value that is the red line. Constant, mean values like the red line are used in the computus equation to evaluate the new and full moons as the best approximation of the astronomical. But the mean value full moons are essentially also what it intended by the biblical directive for the 14th day of the moon. In the sample calendar in Appendix C, the N designates the date of the computus equation new moon based on the mean (red line type) value modeling the astronomical values for conjunction (scattered dot type values). The F dates, however, are representing not only the corresponding computus equation full moon values but also what was in intended by the day of the 14th of the moon: F stands for both the computus Full moon but also the biblical Fourteenth of the moon.

I can show that the F and N values for the 1100 years comprising the database, AD 1550-2649, are the same day as calculated from the astronomical values most of the time, 74% as I recall; for the other 26% they are within +/- 1 day of the astronomical. The N date is the start of the lunar month based strictly on the astronomy, conjunction, and is relevant for a general purpose lunisolar calendar. For an empirical calendar based on observation as in the Bible, and the F now being identified as the14th day, subtract 13 days to get the first day of the estimated observed first crescent (thus 14 days inclusive). I designate this in the printout as m = molad, a term I borrowed from the Hebrew calendar meaning the birth (of the moon) where it can stand for either conjunction or the first crescent. The date of the m entry is always 14 days inclusive from the F entry. The number next to m is the number of days from the N date. It is usually 2 days, so in line with the Gregorian adjustment but in my approach it is based on my computus values for the new and full moons.

So in Appendix C, the Paschal Full Moon on Sun 4-13 is also the 14th day of the observed crescent with conjunction on Sat 3-29 and molad (observation) two days later on 3-31 giving 4-13 as the 14th day inclusive relative to the molad value.

The strictly astronomical lunar month begins on the N date, conjunction, but the biblical, (simulated) empirical lunar month begins on m, the molad date.